Icons Inner Symbol Key (Power Icons Legend)

[Aggelakis]

This is the thread I am pointing Vanden to from this thread on the official forums, regarding his edit (and move) of Icons Inner Symbol Key to Power Icons Legend. Like I said on the forums, his current edits are just fine (since he didn't completely change the theme of the article, just cleaned it up) - just that this thread should be used for commentary and consensus before wholesale changes are made.

Including Eabrace's comment on the discussion page about Icons Outer Ring Key (and its various linked pages).

[storyteller@fuse.net]

I mentioned it on the official forums and I'll mention it here: Where should we put items that are at best guesswork and conjecture?

Separate article, almost as a player guide?  Section of article below the tables?



As Vanden's icon pack illustrates, the iconic system needs to be overhauled and corrected in at least over a hundred places. There are many places where symbols are contradictory, don't follow the convention for other similar powers, or the symbol components to make the correct icon exist, but haven't been put together yet.

Jason Olmstead (UI guy at PS) filled one of the longest open positions they were hiring for. I imagine the backlog of work and ideas they need him to implement will take precedence over fixing power icons to be consistent. Especially, since a player-made solution is available. It would seem to me, that icon inconsistencies are a low priority, quality of life, fix.

[eabrace]

I think that with power icons we have a bit of a special case.  At this point, we're pretty well aware that there are a lot of inconsistencies in the icons.  Those inconsistencies have grown over time as more powers and power sets have been added to the game without anyone to specifically address those issues.  I don't think anyone is going to argue with that.  I would consider documenting those inconsistencies as fair game.

Although this leads to some guesswork and conjecture involved in determining what the icons should or shouldn't be showing us, I've generally found the conclusions reached are well supported by evidence presented.  So long as there is evidence to support a conclusion and both are documented in some way, I can't see anything wrong with recording those conclusions in the article.  (Evidence to support might be better suited for the discussion page lest we flood the article with too much text.)

Guesswork would imply to me that no supporting evidence can be provided for a conclusion.  In these cases, the guesses might be mentioned on the discussion page, but without any supporting evidence, it would probably be best to keep the guesswork out of the article.  If there is a desire to create a second article documenting any guesswork regarding the power icons, the additional article would probably be best suited as a player guide and linked in "See Also" from this article.

Just my thoughts on the matter.  Organizing power info more efficiently is certainly worthwhile.  If anyone has any other ideas on how we might go about this, I think it's worth some discussion.

[GuyPerfect]

One thing I'll have to shoot down right now is Vanden's creation of inexistant overlays and adding them to the article. Extreme melee? Energy defense? Mez debuff? These aren't in the game, and you will not be seeing them in the game, so they shouldn't be in a guide to the game.

For the record, this is brushing up against the reasons I've been keeping the icon compiler tool out of public hands. Now that someone with an imagination has ahold of it, we'll need to keep our eyes on the situation.

[Aggelakis]

... Now that someone with an imagination has ahold of it, we'll need to keep our eyes on the situation.

He's had the icon fix pack for a few years now. He's not new to this.

[shigmiya64]

One thing I'll have to shoot down right now is Vanden's creation of inexistant overlays and adding them to the article. Extreme melee? Energy defense? Mez debuff? These aren't in the game, and you will not be seeing them in the game, so they shouldn't be in a guide to the game.

For the record, this is brushing up against the reasons I've been keeping the icon compiler tool out of public hands. Now that someone with an imagination has ahold of it, we'll need to keep our eyes on the situation.

Hm? I didn't make those overlays, in fact I removed them from the article.  Their presence in the article when they don't appear in-game was one of my chief motivations for rewriting the article.

[GuyPerfect]

I guess I can let you off the hook this time... But I'm still onto you, Batman!

That said, continue: remove any user-imagined images from that article. Only things that actually appear in-game should be documented.

He's had the icon fix pack for a few years now. He's not new to this.

There is something you don't know.

[storyteller@fuse.net]

One thing I'll have to shoot down right now is Vanden's creation of inexistant overlays and adding them to the article. Extreme melee? Energy defense? Mez debuff? These aren't in the game, and you will not be seeing them in the game, so they shouldn't be in a guide to the game.

Don't blame Vanden, I put the images up.  I agree with you that as they are not featured in the game, they shouldn't be part of the main article or, alternately, be a part of a guide to icon inconsistencies.

For the record, this is brushing up against the reasons I've been keeping the icon compiler tool out of public hands. Now that someone with an imagination has ahold of it, we'll need to keep our eyes on the situation.

I do think the icon compiler is a worthwhile application and I personally hope it sees further development and eventual public release.