Base Item images

[Tyrak]

I recently updated the Arcane and Pillars pages of base decorative items with sizes for the items and (where different) their bounding boxes, as well as noting items that mount on a wall or the ceiling and items with unusual visible surfaces (like the top of the ceiling dome) so that people who stack items know which ones to watch out for.  Barring an angry mob, I want to gradually do this for pretty much everything in base items.

I figured I'd do lights next; but images are needed.  If I do them, I would prefer something like this:

For this I was just playing around with the software - imagine the lit torch as being unlit and this being the image for the unlit version.  However, in the old forum opinion seemed to be mildly against including bounding boxes.  For my purposes, including the bounding box would allow me (in most cases, anyway) to note only its size and let people just look to determine the size of the item.

So, comments?  Is it worthwhile to include size information, note unusual properties of items, and have multiple views for some things (like the torch) for people who stack items?  I believe it would be for most ambitious base builders; I know it is for me.  How about the bounding boxes?  If you are against them alone, how about two copies of the item in its natural habitat with one highlighted?  Also, how about a mark (probably a tiny grabbing hand icon) on the image denoting the drag point?  Something like that would be simple to add.

At a guess from what I've done so far, image size would max out at little over 40k and most would be about 20-25k.

If size info, occasional multiple views and a bounding box are okay, I would like to redo many of the existing images.  Some are poorly lit, or at poorly-chosen angles; and I would like to see some done with an eye for stacking.  For example, the stone blocks fit snugly end-to-end, but when placed side-by-side or stacked on top of each other they need to overlap to avoid a gap.  All that can easily be shown in a single image.  Though I suppose that kind of image could be set aside for an article on base-building techniques.

[Sleepykitty]

o.o aahhh... so thats how you where getting the vertical measurements.. ^^;; I feel kinda stupid now..


>.> quick note then, on the footprints, if your marking them down, pls don't bother listing everyone of them, just the abnormal ones that are oddly shaped or extend beyond the object.

Multi-sides pics are fine on those that have different appearances based on sides.. since you have a wall torch there.. are you planning the bottom as well on these things? If the object doesn't have a bottom (which seems something like 80% of all base items) I'd avoid photoing it and instead just making a note of it on the page.

[Tyrak]

>.> quick note then, on the footprints, if your marking them down, pls don't bother listing everyone of them, just the abnormal ones that are oddly shaped or extend beyond the object.

Inclusion of the bounding boxes and correct setup of the objects in the pictures would mean that only a few objects would require measurements for both the object and the bounding box.

Multi-sides pics are fine on those that have different appearances based on sides.. since you have a wall torch there.. are you planning the bottom as well on these things? If the object doesn't have a bottom (which seems something like 80% of all base items) I'd avoid photoing it and instead just making a note of it on the page.

Yes, only floor objects that have bottoms would have those included in the picture; same for ceiling and wall objects.  The overviews should contain the default assumptions, so if a floor object has no picture of the bottom the user should expect that it has none.  Some items still require separate notes, I would think; like the few items with stackable surfaces.

The templates could perhaps be changed to include dimensions of the bounding box .  For lighting, a category could be added for 'produces light'.  Is it worth noting which items have animation?  And given that there are a few dozen of them, would it then be worth including that as a line in the templates?  I would think not; but I recommend adding a 'notes' line to most of the item templates.  So many have enough items with their own quirks worth noting that I don't think the extra blank line for 75% or so of the entries would be a problem.  And in some categories (like pillars), there are no quirks that couldn't be shown in the image.  It would be a place to note that an object has animation, allows things to be stacked on it, differs greatly enough in size from its bounding box to be worth noting despite a picture, and so on.

[Sleepykitty]

For lighting, a category could be added for 'produces light'.

o.o course, there are some that are set to produce light and don't that never got fixed.. you can tell cause they have odd bits showing up above them or have a name that says they do and doesn't.

Is it worth noting which items have animation?  And given that there are a few dozen of them, would it then be worth including that as a line in the templates?  I would think not; but I recommend adding a 'notes' line to most of the item templates.

@.@ I'd agree with you and say it isn't worth the bother to note if they're animated or not. most of the animated ones are pvp and/or crafted anyway... o.o the template should have a notes field you can add info to.. Its been a bit since I've looked at it though, so I'd have to check the page its from to make sure, but I think it was included in the original design.

So many have enough items with their own quirks worth noting that I don't think the extra blank line for 75% or so of the entries would be a problem.  And in some categories (like pillars), there are no quirks that couldn't be shown in the image.  It would be a place to note that an object has animation, allows things to be stacked on it, differs greatly enough in size from its bounding box to be worth noting despite a picture, and so on.

>_> everything that allows stacking should already have that marked on the page for them. I went through myself and added all of those back in '07 or so... Its possible someone removed them (have to check) while I was gone in late summer and not actively checking the wiki...


Follow up:

o.o yup, info is still there! every stackable object in the base has it marked (except the 4 lamps that do.. opps... >_>) on the appropriate page. (though, most of them are on the Desks page) I'll point out that they aren't templated though, I don't think we made a template for the normal base items, just the special functional and crafting ones. Decor item pages are all like the Pillars and Desk pages.

[Tyrak]

o.o course, there are some that are set to produce light and don't that never got fixed.. you can tell cause they have odd bits showing up above them or have a name that says they do and doesn't.

That's why I think there ought to be a line for it.

>_> everything that allows stacking should already have that marked on the page for them. I went through myself and added all of those back in '07 or so... Its possible someone removed them (have to check) while I was gone in late summer and not actively checking the wiki...


Follow up:

o.o yup, info is still there! every stackable object in the base has it marked (except the 4 lamps that do.. opps... >_>) on the appropriate page. (though, most of them are on the Desks page) I'll point out that they aren't templated though, I don't think we made a template for the normal base items, just the special functional and crafting ones. Decor item pages are all like the Pillars and Desk pages.

No, several stackable items aren't noted as such.  The modern art and banners from wall details, the cubicle from other furniture (on which you can place wall items), the floor safe and floor tile from room details, several lights - more than just the four versions of hanging lamp... probably a few others I'm not thinking of right now.  For the lights, some stack from the ceiling, some from the floor, some from the wall, and some of them allow you to place objects at angles.  Some of these (possibly all) were changed in issue 13 and some of them were apparently just never noticed.

[Sleepykitty]

No, several stackable items aren't noted as such.

^^;; well, I did say "should be". Though I should also point out, that when I say stackable, I'm referring to sticking things on top of other things, not on the sides, as I've noticed that some of the cabinets sort of let you.

The modern art and banners from wall details, the cubicle from other furniture (on which you can place wall items), the floor safe and floor tile from room details, several lights - more than just the four versions of hanging lamp... probably a few others I'm not thinking of right now.

>.> I think we need to start specifying if we're meaning stacking as vertical (ie, on top) or horizontal (ie on the side). the cubicle is obviously on the side, but do you mean the same for the arts and banners? As for lighting, I wasn't aware that any of the hanging lamps where altered, back in i7 (or was it 8?) the two different sets of asian tier floor lamps where altered to allow stacking (might have been between i6 and 7, it was before Statesman fired 75% of the staff). I'm fairly sure that none of the others at that time where altered, but I could have missed them when I went through and tested everything way back when.

For the lights, some stack from the ceiling, some from the floor, some from the wall, and some of them allow you to place objects at angles.  Some of these (possibly all) were changed in issue 13 and some of them were apparently just never noticed.

@.@ oh? those went through? I thought they reverted them during testing...
>_> hunm.. guess I should have done my old random base tests with every beta again.. kinda stopped after they cut the base invention system out.

[Tyrak]

>.> I think we need to start specifying if we're meaning stacking as vertical (ie, on top) or horizontal (ie on the side). the cubicle is obviously on the side, but do you mean the same for the arts and banners?

The wall banners (not the standing ones) count as walls for placing wall details, both front and back.  The modern art (not the pictures, but the collection of squares and rectangles) counts as a wall for the front, back, left and right.  At a variety of depths, too.  Items that 'stack' in this manner can be pulled out from the wall just by selecting the item and dragging the cursor so that it is over the item.  The wall torch, wall sconces and round lights allow wall items to be hung at a variety of angles (all still vertical, however) based on the angle of the surface at the cursor.

The terms stacking and floating are pretty much used interchangibly.  There is no differentiation between lifting off the floor, lowering down from the ceiling, or bringing out from the wall as far as I've seen.

As for lighting, I wasn't aware that any of the hanging lamps where altered, back in i7 (or was it 8?) the two different sets of asian tier floor lamps where altered to allow stacking (might have been between i6 and 7, it was before Statesman fired 75% of the staff). I'm fairly sure that none of the others at that time where altered, but I could have missed them when I went through and tested everything way back when.

The lights called floor lamps allow stacking in the same way, though less usefully since the pole is tiny.  Most and possibly all of the ceiling lights allow stacking of ceiling items to lower them.  I believe all the wall lights can be hung on themselves or each other, and I think they allow other wall items to be hung on them.  As part of the measuring and picture-taking process I would also be checking for stackable surfaces, just to be sure I know them all.

@.@ oh? those went through? I thought they reverted them during testing...
>_> hunm.. guess I should have done my old random base tests with every beta again.. kinda stopped after they cut the base invention system out.

You should visit the Player Help - Base Construction forum at the CoH forums.  A few fairly minor changes have had major impacts on base design just by making the process of stacking and floating items trivially easy.  It's allowed a lot more people to be creative with their designs, and the mixing of ideas in the forum has helped that along tremendously.