Author Topic: The Magicians  (Read 7642 times)

Mandu

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The Magicians
« on: April 16, 2017, 09:09:43 PM »
Does anybody else watch this?  While watching this week I realized something.  This is the only series that I actually look forward to watching any more. 

The CW series, SHIELD, Into the Badlands.  I enjoy all of them enough while I am watching them but when an episode is over it's over.  If it's a week till the next episode or six months it's all the same.  I'll watch it when it arrives.  The Magicians though when each episode ends I immediately want to see the next one.

Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2017, 09:50:15 PM »
I liked season one a lot but I'm so full up on weekly watches I've been waiting for the season to end to watch it and the expanse. Prolly going to do the same for into the badlands. But yeah those I actually enjoy whereas most of the ones I watch as they're aired I can't stand. But if I don't keep up I can't join in on all the complaining on here :D

Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2017, 12:03:29 AM »
I started watching it, but I didn't make it through the first season.  It's like if CW tried to do Harry Potter and Harry was obsessed with the Chronicles of Narnia.  Someone passed me the books, and so far that's had better pacing.  But I haven't read far enough to where the characters might make me hate them all yet...
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Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2017, 12:41:12 AM »
I liked season one a lot but I'm so full up on weekly watches I've been waiting for the season to end to watch it and the expanse. Prolly going to do the same for into the badlands. But yeah those I actually enjoy whereas most of the ones I watch as they're aired I can't stand. But if I don't keep up I can't join in on all the complaining on here :D

Good idea.  Season 2 starts of disappointing but really builds well and now I'm again thoroughly hooked.

I think what keeps me going most on this is the realization that Q isn't the hero.  He's the villain.  Sure he's the central protagonist sort of but when you think of it almost everything that goes wrong can be traced to something he did or instigated.  If I had to think of him as the good guy I wouldn't be able to stand his whiny self pity. 

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2017, 12:43:29 AM »
I started watching it, but I didn't make it through the first season.  It's like if CW tried to do Harry Potter and Harry was obsessed with the Chronicles of Narnia.  Someone passed me the books, and so far that's had better pacing.  But I haven't read far enough to where the characters might make me hate them all yet...

So how far did you get into the first season?  Yes Q is a whiny Narnia obsessed self pitying Harry Potter.  The other characters are what makes it worth while.  Alice and Penny for season 1 and Penny and Julia for season 2.

eabrace

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2017, 02:22:04 AM »
You know, I found season one to be entirely forgettable.  Literally, not figuratively.  I barely remember anything from season one.  I need to go back to watch the season finale again to understand a bunch of callbacks that I didn't get at the start of season two.

Season two, on the other hand, I'm finding to be much better written and - not coincidentally - far more memorable.
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Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2017, 04:49:43 AM »
So how far did you get into the first season?  Yes Q is a whiny Narnia obsessed self pitying Harry Potter.  The other characters are what makes it worth while.  Alice and Penny for season 1 and Penny and Julia for season 2.

Apparently, I watched the first 8 episodes.  I disliked Julia from the start, assuming that's Quentin's friend at the start that he had an ongoing crush on.  The more stupid decisions she made while being whiny, the more I hated her and her awful subplots.

If Alice is the nerdy girl who got together with Quentin then flipped around in true melodramatic CW relationship fashion, and who found out what happened to her brother and put people in danger because she couldn't let it go...  I started out ready to like her but she made me hate her.  I think it was some nonsense with her that may have finally put me off.

The teleporting guy and the gay sort of frat leader (is that Penny and Eliot?) were each a variety of jerk that might be likable in contrast to other likable characters, but unfortunately the closest thing they'd had to that was Quentin.

And Quentin, well... he's had moments where I started to like him, but something always manages to ruin the moment.

The worst part is that there's a story there that's right up my alley, if only the characters weren't hell bent on making me loathe them.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2017, 02:47:57 AM »
Ok, so Julia is unlikable but you can pretty much blame that on Quentin.  After all the moment she didn't make it into the college he pretty much said "I know we're lifelong friends but too bad so sad.  I'm gonna have fun at school."  And although it seems to make no sense that she didn't make it in and he did there is actually a very valid reason.

Yes Alice is the nerdy girl who pulled a CW flipout.  But once you meet her parents you realize exactly why she is the way she is about relationships. And what happens with her by season two completely changes who and what she is.

Penny and Eliot are both jerks but season 2 they both grow tremendously.

I think that's part of what I like most about it.  The characters grow and change in logical fashion.  They aren't like CW characters who change between one episode and the next for no discernible reason.

Remember, these are college students and most of them are in their first year in college. There is no more obnoxious and opinionated being on the face of the earth than a new college student.  Eliot and Margo aren't new but they are frat/sorority dwellers whose life up until this point has revolved around being popular.


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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #8 on: April 19, 2017, 02:40:50 PM »
I enjoyed the first season, so read the books during the off-season.  Like most show adaptations, it's been moving further and further from the source.  You can see where they're trying to incorporate elements from the later books but events are so different it no longer fits.  Doing my best to enjoy both stories, and looking forward to a few scenes from the books making it into the show.

I don't look at these as the normal novel series with a grand arc.  It's a Slice of Life story where the characters deal with a few major events, but most of the story is just them going day to day.  No one (except Alice and Jane) is working towards any great goal.  Everyone else is pulled into their stories.  You can decide for yourself if you think using a side character as the main focus is an innovative writing choice, or a bad idea.  I find it interesting since it's not very common.

I don't think of Q as the villain, he's trying to live his life.  So far his life has been pretty crappy.  He's a high functioning schitzophrenic with anxiety and depression.  The fact that magic and Fillory turned out to be real doesn't change that fact.  For all his belief and desire, he's not even very good at magic.  He has to master something before he can do it at even the basic level.  "No middle gears."  All or nothing.  So he spends most of his life failing.  Constantly being told you're wrong, and constantly failing drains you, even (especially) if you're later proved right.  His choices reflect that.  He's not a villain, he just kinda sucks at life.  He has no grand goals until he adopts someone else's.

e-

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Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2017, 05:47:58 AM »
Halfway through season 2 now. definitely hits its stride, liking it a lot more than 1. the digital underground line was just great.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2017, 05:36:12 PM »
I don't think of Q as the villain, he's trying to live his life.  So far his life has been pretty crappy.  He's a high functioning schitzophrenic with anxiety and depression.  The fact that magic and Fillory turned out to be real doesn't change that fact.  For all his belief and desire, he's not even very good at magic.  He has to master something before he can do it at even the basic level.  "No middle gears."  All or nothing.  So he spends most of his life failing.  Constantly being told you're wrong, and constantly failing drains you, even (especially) if you're later proved right.  His choices reflect that.  He's not a villain, he just kinda sucks at life.  He has no grand goals until he adopts someone else's.

e-

Ok, not so much villain as catalyst.  He isn't deliberately screwing everybody over but it is almost always his actions that cause things to go bad and rarely his actions that cause something to go good.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2018, 11:41:24 AM »
Ok, digging this old topic up just because the forum always wants you to start a new one.

I've realized that although I enjoy all the other series this is the only show that is must watch each week.  I actually missed 3 episodes of Arrow and didn't even realize it till I want to watch what I thought was the next episode.

And what made me want to bring up this old topic is that I have gone back and watched the musical number from episode 9 multiple times now and it reminded me of how I would go back to watch specific scenes or episodes of Buffy and Angel.  The Magicians (for me at least) is another Buffy.  An ok first season that in the following seasons went on to become my favorite series.

doc7924

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2018, 11:49:48 PM »
This isn't like a reboot of the old 'Magician' show starring Bill Bixby?


Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2018, 04:20:20 AM »
This isn't like a reboot of the old 'Magician' show starring Bill Bixby?

No.  It's based on a series of novels released post-2000.  It's a Harry Potter meets Narnia pastiche with all the wonder and goodness squeezed out and replaced with a pile of dirty socks and depression.

I started watching again a little while back after stopping partway through season 1.  Currently I'm stopped again right at the last episode of season 2.  If Netflix gets a season 3, assuming it exists, it might kick start my viewing again.  It wouldn't be bad if the characters weren't so unlikable.  In season two they worked their way up to almost tolerable at times.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2018, 11:27:38 AM »
The series of novels are really poorly written. This is a case of the adaptation actually being much better than the original.


Place Harry Potter in college instead of middle school and make it like a real world college rather than some fantasy castle.  It has the same basic concept.  Mundane person finds out that magic is real when he is recruited for a school.  And the characters all act like college students too. Like I said, my favorite series where the characters all actually grow and change.

Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2018, 02:43:34 PM »
I'd say that the main character has hardly seemed to grow or change much.  His hedonistic friend, however, got dragged kicking and screaming down the path of growth and change.  That alone has made season 2 worth slogging through. 
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2018, 08:14:44 PM »
I think the not growing is intended to be a feature not a bug.

eabrace

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2018, 08:23:20 PM »
If Netflix gets a season 3, assuming it exists, it might kick start my viewing again.
Season 3 is just about to wrap up on SyFy, so it's pretty likely you'll see it on Netflix some time toward the end of the year.

After the first season, I honestly wouldn't have missed the show (or likely even noticed) if it hadn't come back for a second season.  The characters were all just irredeemably annoying to me.

The second season was a vast improvement.  I think it really turned a corner for me with the dragon muttering about "f*&$ing milennials".  That still makes me laugh.

This latest season is actually really good.  There's only one or two characters that I think should be given less and less screen time as they go at this point.  The banter between Eliot and Margo is fantastic.
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Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2018, 02:15:26 AM »
I'd say that the main character has hardly seemed to grow or change much.  His hedonistic friend, however, got dragged kicking and screaming down the path of growth and change.  That alone has made season 2 worth slogging through.

I agree that Quentin is the one constant and I maintain that he is there not so much as a character but a catalyst.   He is a Ron Weasley who considers himself as the hero of the story.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2018, 02:20:40 AM »
Season 3 is just about to wrap up on SyFy, so it's pretty likely you'll see it on Netflix some time toward the end of the year.

After the first season, I honestly wouldn't have missed the show (or likely even noticed) if it hadn't come back for a second season.  The characters were all just irredeemably annoying to me.

The second season was a vast improvement.  I think it really turned a corner for me with the dragon muttering about "f*&$ing milennials".  That still makes me laugh.

This latest season is actually really good.  There's only one or two characters that I think should be given less and less screen time as they go at this point.  The banter between Eliot and Margo is fantastic.

Eliot and Margo are the characters who have grown the most. They went from being the shallowest and most self involved caring only for their popularity and partying, to being the ones who are the most selfless.  I like that even Eliot noticed it and joked about it this season.  I hated Margo season 1 and this season she is my favorite. Penny has also become a favorite.  Alice has slipped to the bottom.

eabrace

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #20 on: March 20, 2018, 06:20:46 PM »
Alice has slipped to the bottom.
At this point, I think even that assessment might be generous.  She's so far down below the bottom right now that even a hint of a new recurring character being introduced ("Hi, Felicia!") is exciting because it means Alice might get less screen time.
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Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #21 on: April 06, 2018, 11:36:40 AM »
Another season finished, another big bad set up for next season.

And I really hate Alice.  Which makes me love the series even more.  I can't think of any other series that has made me go from loving to hating characters and vice versa. I can think of actors who have done that (Willa Holland comes to mind) but not actual characters.

Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #22 on: April 06, 2018, 04:33:31 PM »
I liked Grant in Agents of SHIELD and then they made me utterly despise him.

I hated Donna Noble and then she became one of the best of the Doctor's companions.

Turning in a negative direction is dangerous, though.  After Grant irredeemably turned I almost stopped watching.  And anytime he showed up from that point on it damaged my interest in whatever was going on.  It's odd that I can like to hate a character, but not if it was a character I once liked.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

doc7924

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #23 on: April 06, 2018, 09:44:32 PM »
I liked Grant in Agents of SHIELD and then they made me utterly despise him.

I hated Donna Noble and then she became one of the best of the Doctor's companions.

Turning in a negative direction is dangerous, though.  After Grant irredeemably turned I almost stopped watching.  And anytime he showed up from that point on it damaged my interest in whatever was going on.  It's odd that I can like to hate a character, but not if it was a character I once liked.

Then they did their job.

I felt exactly the same way about both.

Thought Donna was so annoying in her first story and up ended up being my favorite 10th Doctor companion.

Ward was like that Belushi SNL sketch -> "The Thing That Wouldn't Leave!"


Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #24 on: April 07, 2018, 12:45:12 AM »
I never stopped hating Donna.  I still hope for a reunion show where she gets back her memories and dies screaming in horrible pain as she goes insane.

Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #25 on: August 16, 2018, 04:20:44 AM »
I finally got around to s3 (yay) just in time to have nothing to add here but early enough that i'll have forgotten it all by the time next season airs.

Mandu

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #26 on: August 19, 2018, 06:35:10 PM »
I finally got around to s3 (yay) just in time to have nothing to add here but early enough that i'll have forgotten it all by the time next season airs.

Although I enjoyed the season overall I'll have to agree that it is entirely unmemorable.  Except for the musical episode. Out of all the various geek tv series that have done musical episodes the Under Pressure number was my favorite.

Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #27 on: August 19, 2018, 07:06:21 PM »
I'd have fast-forwarded all the musical stuff were it not interspersed with non- and were i not already watching at 2.4x. So even though it was of better quality than other shows' musical stuff it was worse for me in that, eg. Barry/Kara were easily skippable.

I'm hoping there's more to S4 than the big bad they've set up, as that seems like it'll wear thin really fast.

Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #28 on: August 19, 2018, 11:09:23 PM »
Although I enjoyed the season overall I'll have to agree that it is entirely unmemorable.  Except for the musical episode. Out of all the various geek tv series that have done musical episodes the Under Pressure number was my favorite.

I like a good musical episode.  The mere mention of this one made me confirm that the season is as yet unavailable on my streaming services (please don't bother sending me any more potential download links that I can't really use, but thanks for the thought).  The only one I've seen that I remember and indeed still occasionally sing songs from, however, is the one from Buffy.

Edit: Ah, glancing at YT it looks like it was more Glee than Galavant.  Musical, but not a musical.  And mangling Queen is unforgivable.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 11:18:48 PM by Tenzhi »
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Vee

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #29 on: August 20, 2018, 01:55:57 AM »
Does this mean an official moratorium on Rickrolling Tenzhi?

Tenzhi

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Re: The Magicians
« Reply #30 on: August 20, 2018, 05:36:31 AM »
Does this mean an official moratorium on Rickrolling Tenzhi?

It's not that.  On a few occasions folks have helpfully PMd me links and/or instructions to acquire series episodes that I can't really use as I don't have a PC these days and do all my watching on console.  Just trying to save folks the effort.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.