Re-evaluating Recipe/Enhancement articles

[Thirty-Seven]

...one.

I only made one as a stand in for the Example pages we were creating.  And it doesn't appear in any actual article.  I apologize that I couldn't be bothered to make it right for a dummy article. 

Also, I have never purchased an SBE, so I wasn't sure on the formatting... and knew it didn't matter one iota.

[GuyPerfect]

Since we're talking about it, I have a serious peeve with calling these "store bought" or even "purchased" Enhancements. While it's true that's the only way to get them right now, there's nothing intrinsic about the items themselves that says they have to be bought.

The term we should be using is Attuned, which is exactly the way they're differentiated from Invention in the long-text descriptions. SBE, therefore, should be a redirect to Attuned Enhancements

[Sekoia]

Thanks for point about Attuned, Guy. I'd never seen the long text description. I wonder what the best thing to be calling the IO versions is? We often use either "Invention Origin" or "Crafted", which are more analogous to "Store Bought" and "Purchased" than they are to "Attuned".

In a totally different vein, I have been thinking about the comment made, I think by Sekoia, on one of the Example pages' talk sections regarding the various IOFlags we use now and how much vertical real-estate they take up to convey very little information more than their symbols already do.  So, I got to thinking that maybe something like the top part of the below image could be used... with links from each symbol to a relevant article and Alt-text that gives a brief description of what it means.

Yep, I had made that point and had done something similar on my test page as well. I was putting the sample icons in the relevant section though instead of at the top of the page:
http://paragonwiki.com/w/index.php?title=User:Sekoia/Sandbox/Performance_Shifter:_Chance_for_%2BEndurance&oldid=224988

One of the things we'd potentially want to flag is "This can be bought and sold on the Market". That only applies to one of the two versions of the enhancement. There may be other things we want to have available via quick-ref icons as well that only apply to one or the other. I'm inclined to keep the icons in the individual sections where they apply. That also means if there's a ton of icon flags for an enhancement, they get split up a bit to make them less of an icon-dump.

[Codewalker]

The term we should be using is Attuned, which is exactly the way they're differentiated from Invention in the long-text descriptions. SBE, therefore, should be a redirect to Attuned Enhancements

Which also gets confusing because technically the store-bought enhancements are both Attuned and Account Bound.

Contrast with (non-superior) ATOs, which are Attuned but not bound and can be traded.

[Thirty-Seven]

So.... the forum tells me it has been more than 10 days and I might not want to post.

Have we thought about this anymore?  I would love to begin doing some formatting and Template re-creation, and such... but it doesn't seem like we are even close to that stage yet (let alone re-categorization).  Also, we prolly will need to draft the handy Sekoia-Bot or somesuch to knock out some of the work as well.

(In case you didn't know... this is a BUMP in disguise, like a sneaky little bacalao!)

[GuyPerfect]

Some notes all jotted-down-like.

Enhancement Set
Official term for a group of Enhancements. Slotting multiple Enhancements from the same Set into the same Power will activate Set Bonuses.

Invention Enhancement
Official term for crafted Enhancements. These originate as Recipes, which must be Crafted with Invention Salvage (statistically; some non-Enhancement Recipes don't use any Salvage). Colloquially, these are known as "IOs".

Archetype Enhancement
Official term for Enhancements that can only be used by specific Archetypes. These exist only in Enhancement form, and can be traded between players and sold on the consignment. Colloquially, these are known as "ATOs".

Attuned Enhancement
Official term for an Enhancement that scales to your Combat Level rather than having a fixed value or shutting off when you level up too far. These also exist only in Enhancement form. Some can be traded, others cannot. There is currently no colloquial term for these. Since all Archetype Enhancements are also Attuned, ATO is sufficient for describing them. The other Attuned Enhancements are different versions of Invention Enhancements available only in the Paragon Market, and the wiki has been calling these "Store-Bought Enhancements," or SBEs.

Account Bound
Official term for an Enhancement that cannot be traded to other players, but can be sent to one's own global handle via global e-mail. The term is not reserved for Enhancements, though currently it only applies to them. I understand the devs do want to support Account Bound Salvage to let players send Enhancement Catalysts to themselves.

Overwhelming Force
A particular Attuned Enhancement Set that is acquired through special means. It is not an Archetype set, nor is it an Invention set. The phenomenon I've experienced is that the player base is for whatever reason averse to referring to this as an "Attuned" set. People have been taking to calling it a "Universal Damage Enhancement" set, or UDEs, and have begun lumping the Archetype Enhancements under the same term. This is dangerous, because there's nothing that says future Attuned or Archetype sets will be damage-based.

[GuyPerfect]

To rework all Enhancement articles, I would like to see the following take place:


Move how-to-get off the top of the page
Currently, the first thing you see for any Enhancement is how many Merit Vendors don't sell it (at least, I think that's the lesson I was supposed to take away from this). The first thing you should see is what the Enhancement does and at what levels you can slot it. That's currently sandwiched between how-to-get and how-to-craft, which I wouldn't say is all that helpful for the curious browser.

I would reorganize all Enhancement articles thusly:

• "Overview" section, possibly not labeled. Contains name, icon(s) and description
• "Effects" section, listing strength by level where applicable, as well as any other effects as plain English
• "How to Get" section, describing how to receive the Enhancement
  
  • Since most Invention Enhancements also have Attuned versions that are interchangeable, both versions should be documented
  • For Invention Enhancements, list how to obtain the Recipe, then its Crafting requirements
  • For all other Enhancements, list the tasks or purchases required to obtain the Enhancement
• "Vendors" section, describing only those Vendors (Merit, Ticket, Candy Cane) from which the Enhancement or Recipe can be obtained
• "Sale and Trade" section, indicating whether the Enhancement can be traded or sold on the consignment, and for how much it can be sold to NPC stores

This will accommodate other Enhancements like Single-Origin or Hamidon as well, without plugging up the page with Invention-related fluff that doesn't apply.


Ditch the notion of "special" Enhancements

All Enhancements can be classified in some form or another, and I don't think it's appropriate to just lump any under the "special" label just because we don't feel like doing anything with it.


Redo the categories
We're currently banking pretty hard on the notion that all Enhancement Sets and their Enhancements pertain to the Invention System, which is no longer true. We've got a pretty information-rich article called Invention Origin Enhancement Sets which is no longer a comprehensive list of Enhancement Sets. It should become an article titled simply "Enhancement Sets" and contain all Enhancement Sets regardless of type.

I'd rework the categories like this:

• Enhancements - Top-level category for all Enhancement sub-categories
• Enhancement Sets - Top-level category for all Enhancement Set sub-categories
• Invention Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Attuned Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Archetype Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Training Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Dual-Origin Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Single-Origin Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Hydra Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Crystal Titan Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Hamidon Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Going Rogue Pre-Order Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Invention Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Archetype Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Attuned Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets

In the case of Synthetic Hamidon Enhancements, I think those should be redirects to their non-synthetic counterparts, since they are in all capacities identical except for the name. The Hamidon Enhancement articles should simply have a note that the word "Synthetic" appears if you get it through a Task Force rather than the Hamidon Trial.

In addition to the generic categories, a few specific categories may also be useful:

• Unique Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Account Bound Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• PvP Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Very Rare Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Proc Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• PvP Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Very Rare Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets

[GuyPerfect]

I've created a mockup for how I envision the new Enhancement articles looking:

Hecatomb: Chance for Negative Energy Damage

[Thirty-Seven]

WOW!  Lots to read here, but the example mock-up looks really good to me.

My only suggestions would be that we alter the IOFlag-type "banners" to be all in one box and take up less space while we do it.  And of course, auto-add to non-invention related categories.

Oh, and what of the notion of the new Recipe: and Enhancement: namespaces?

[Cannonfodder]

I think we're also going to have to edit some of the definition articles (or things that should now be definition articles).

Take for example the widely different format/styles of:  http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Attuned, http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Account_Bound, http://wiki.cohtitan.com/wiki/Archetype_Enhancements.   The style of each article varies widely.  I think they should mostly follow the style of definition articles with the use of See Also and Examples included on each page as needed.

It seems the new article structure (GP's, which I like) would change many of these varying types of pages over to straight definitions or disambig pages (with definition being listed first/primary use?).  Some of the details from each could be worked into existing articles (something like Invention [disabig for definition, invention system, invention origin] vs. the Invention System itself [which has many of the details from the current Invention page]).

I don't think it needs to be done right away compared to the revision of the structure of enhancements as a whole (higher priority!) but I wanted to put it on the radar so we can think about it and remember to do it along with the enhancement changes.

(Boy, am I thinking in parentheses today!)  ;)

[Sekoia]

Oh, and what of the notion of the new Recipe: and Enhancement: namespaces?

This is something that had been agreed upon previously, so I'm strongly inclined to transition to separate Recipe and Enhancement namespaces. Especially since the Recipes generally have a moderately different name than the Enhancements. Any proposal for a modification to the system needs to mock up separate Recipe and Enhancement articles.

I would reorganize all Enhancement articles thusly:

• "Overview" section, possibly not labeled. Contains name, icon(s) and description
• "Effects" section, listing strength by level where applicable, as well as any other effects as plain English
• "How to Get" section, describing how to receive the Enhancement
  
  • Since most Invention Enhancements also have Attuned versions that are interchangeable, both versions should be documented
  • For Invention Enhancements, list how to obtain the Recipe, then its Crafting requirements
  • For all other Enhancements, list the tasks or purchases required to obtain the Enhancement
• "Vendors" section, describing only those Vendors (Merit, Ticket, Candy Cane) from which the Enhancement or Recipe can be obtained
• "Sale and Trade" section, indicating whether the Enhancement can be traded or sold on the consignment, and for how much it can be sold to NPC stores

I'm supportive of the general direction you went with this. A few things:
- I'm not a huge fan of the huge banners we use for things like Proc and Unique flags, or for things like vendor purchases. Those details do not need that much screen real estate. I proposed before that we collapse these down to simple icons (like this). The relevant information can then also be communicated in text form, either with normal bullet points or in paragraph form. That gives something for our eyes to quickly find at a glance (which is what those banners are likely intended for) while still keeping all the information present.
- For Invention Enhancements, we should not list crafting requirements. That information belongs in the recipe article. That will also make the enhancement article much less busy.
- Vendors that sell the recipe should be noted on the Recipe's article. Vendors that sell the enhancement should be noted on the Enhancement's article in the "How to Get" section.
- "Sales and Trade" is also a method of "How to Get". The two sections should be merged.

I'd rework the categories like this:

• Enhancements - Top-level category for all Enhancement sub-categories
• Enhancement Sets - Top-level category for all Enhancement Set sub-categories
• Invention Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Attuned Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Archetype Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Training Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Dual-Origin Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Single-Origin Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Hydra Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Crystal Titan Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Hamidon Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Going Rogue Pre-Order Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Invention Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Archetype Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Attuned Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets

In the case of Synthetic Hamidon Enhancements, I think those should be redirects to their non-synthetic counterparts, since they are in all capacities identical except for the name. The Hamidon Enhancement articles should simply have a note that the word "Synthetic" appears if you get it through a Task Force rather than the Hamidon Trial.

In addition to the generic categories, a few specific categories may also be useful:

• Unique Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Account Bound Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• PvP Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Very Rare Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• Proc Enhancements - Sub-category of Enhancements
• PvP Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets
• Very Rare Enhancement Sets - Sub-category of Enhancement Sets

I'm supportive of this categorization framework.

[GuyPerfect]

"Sales and Trade" is also a method of "How to Get". The two sections should be merged.

No no nonononononono. Sale and Trade is how to get rid of it, not how to obtain it. All the time people are asking "Cool, so now that I have one, can I give it to other players?"

[Sekoia]

No no nonononononono. Sale and Trade is how to get rid of it, not how to obtain it. All the time people are asking "Cool, so now that I have one, can I give it to other players?"

They're two sides of the same coin. Sale and Trade are a method of obtaining items, as well as getting rid of them. You acquire when a Vendor sells an item to you, you get rid of when you sell to a Vendor. You acquire when someone trades an item to you via the Auction House or via the Trade interface, and you get rid of when you trade the item to someone else via those same means.

[GuyPerfect]

Then we'll be documenting one-way vendor sales in the how-to-get section. |-:

[Sekoia]

Then we'll be documenting one-way vendor sales in the how-to-get section. |-:

You can always give the section a different name. It doesn't have to be "How to Get".

I suppose they could be split into two separate sections, but both would need to reference trade.

[eabrace]

Maybe just "Marketing Information"?  Trading is a form of marketing, as are buying and selling.

[Sekoia]

Not all recipes are obtained via purchase. Random drops, for instance, wouldn't fall under "Marketing Information", but I would include it in that section.

[GuyPerfect]

I really want to stress that How to Get refers to the tasks or actions required to get ahold of the recipes/Enhancements. That is to say, "have someone else give it to you" is not the same thing as "earn it." You earn a Hamidon Enhancement by defeating the Hamidon. To me, that's not even in the same time zone as "pull one out of base storage."

[eabrace]

Well, maybe if you figure out how to pull one out of someone else's base storage...

[Sekoia]

I really want to stress that How to Get refers to the tasks or actions required to get ahold of the recipes/Enhancements. That is to say, "have someone else give it to you" is not the same thing as "earn it." You earn a Hamidon Enhancement by defeating the Hamidon. To me, that's not even in the same time zone as "pull one out of base storage."

That may be your intent, but that's not what "How to Get" means. Your intent would be better reflected by "How to Earn".

However, I think it's more useful to list the methods of acquiring an item rather than simply the methods of earning it.