Author Topic: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.  (Read 333214 times)

LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #840 on: March 22, 2014, 06:52:56 PM »
Wait, does that mean that -- if they wanted to -- Eidos could decide I'm not allowed to re-play any of the old Tomb Raider games I bought?  Could Atari legally make me destroy my old Tank and Adventure cartridges for the 2600?

If the license provides for it?  Yes they can.
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LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #841 on: March 22, 2014, 07:03:09 PM »
Azrael, I feel your pain which is why I prefer running open source software with GPL or BSD licenses where I can.  Most of the software is pretty good and almost every business app has an open source rival.  And, some of the open source is better than the for pay software.
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LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #842 on: March 22, 2014, 07:05:03 PM »
Ha ha, brilliant.  Sounds like a case of taking words meant to apply to printed medium (where it makes perfect sense) and applying them to a new medium without understanding the technology.

Yep but I prefer it over DMCA.  DMCA is far worse.
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Azrael

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #843 on: March 22, 2014, 10:20:29 PM »
as far as the atari console and cartridges? no. those are analogue technology and not protected by the DCMA. You literally, physically, bought a copy of the hardware and software when purchasing the carts which used solid state transistor tech to encode their data, therefore you own that copy in perpetuity and can do what you like with it until such day as it dies or you do.

as to the rest. kill all the lawyers.

LOL.  I love it.  Good catch. :P  When did owning software get this complicated?  Back in teh 'owd' C64 days...

Azrael.

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Azrael, I feel your pain which is why I prefer running open source software with GPL or BSD licenses where I can.  Most of the software is pretty good and almost every business app has an open source rival.  And, some of the open source is better than the for pay software.
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Cheers, Lady Vamp.  I'd 'lost it' for a while there.  Howling at the moon.  It must have been my time of the week.  I'm just getting fed up of Corporations pushing their luck with the over reaching land grab.  I use Apple kit because I find it simple to use.  But I had a friend who used Linux and open source software like Gimp etc.  And some of it is really good. ;)  It was the use of command line  stuff that I found intimidating.  If Apple ever start pushing their luck too much with me and Linux have a Mac like experience...it won't take me long to push the 'red' button.  I've tried having a Windows tower twice before.  It rubbed my rhubarb both times.  Not for me.

Jeeze.  I used to have cassettes and wait 30 minutes for a game to load in the early 80s.  I used to buy vinyls.  Occasionally tape stuff.  Then we get to CDs and DVDs and everything is suddenly complicated and DRM infested.  As we go to all digital their seems to be a trampling of more and more consumer rights in terms of fair use etc.

I can see why people go open source.  A poke into the eye of Corporate Hubris.  And as much as I like Apple kit they're sitting on 150 billion and it's never enough as they raise the entry prices on their desktops.

Uh-oh.  Starting to rant again...
« Last Edit: March 22, 2014, 10:29:51 PM by Azrael »

Arcana

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #844 on: March 23, 2014, 06:07:00 AM »
And as much as I like Apple kit they're sitting on 150 billion and it's never enough as they raise the entry prices on their desktops.
You know, it was not all that long ago when people were wondering if Macs were a novel but endangered species, and the betting pool was whether they would be bought by Sun and turned into their cute low end gimmick or bought by Oracle and disassembled for the technology or bought by Sony and turned into a VAIO subbrand.  No one seriously thought they would even still be around in 2014 that wasn't insane.  Part of the culture Jobs brought to Apple was that Apple was no longer going to play everyone else's game.  They were not going to be the best among many, they were going to be the only among nobody.  They were going to create their own market, target only those customers that wanted that market, and charge a premium for that market.  That's why the focus on high end laptops, then iTunes and iPods, then iPhones, then iPads.  And in every case, the same thing happened.  Some people said it was too expensive, and Apple said if its too expensive for you, too bad for you.

The lesson they learned was that if you do what everyone tells you that you have to do, because that's what everyone else is supposed to do, you will eventually lose if for no other reason than you get unlucky.  Apple doesn't really care about the cash, its just that they also don't care about the people who complain everything is priced at a premium.  Remember when conventional wisdom said Apple should get completely out of the hardware market and just sell MacOS licenses to PC clone manufacturers, because its impossible to compete with hardware?  Whenever someone tells Apple what they are doing wrong with regard to pricing, they remember when that was conventional wisdom.  Which was even more severely wrong than when Microsoft thought that internet-thing wouldn't amount to much.

Its really hard to blame them.  If Apple had listened to what conventional wisdom was telling them at any point in time between 1999 and yesterday, there would be no Apple today.  I can't think of one good reason why Apple should listen to any outsider that tells them what they are doing is completely wrong.

Arcana

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #845 on: March 23, 2014, 06:21:22 AM »
as far as the atari console and cartridges? no. those are analogue technology and not protected by the DCMA. You literally, physically, bought a copy of the hardware and software when purchasing the carts which used solid state transistor tech to encode their data, therefore you own that copy in perpetuity and can do what you like with it until such day as it dies or you do.
Oh boy.

1.  2600 cartridges are digital technology, not analog technology.

2.  All transistors are "solid state."  All transistors (in any technology you're likely to encounter) are made from semiconductor material.  The term "solid state" was invented to distinguish semiconductor materials from vacuum tube technology.

3.  The DMCA is not limited to purely digital systems.  For example, see 17 US 1201(k), aka the "Macrovision provision" which deals with copy protection technology used in analog recordings and transmissions.

4.  While the DMCA amends copyright, it is not the totality of copyright protection on software.  Software is protected by copyright separate from DMCA provisions.

5.  Software licenses and EULAs are not specifically the realm of the DMCA.  They are a part of contract law.

6.  As far as I know, Atari 2600 cartridges were sold, not licensed, so yes, there's no license that can be revoked.  The copyright owner can limit your ability to make unauthorized copies of the work or use the work in a manner that requires a license (for example, technically you can't just to a public performance of playing the game without permission).  But because they did not sell a license to the software, they sold a usable media with a copy of the software on it with the implicit right to run it, your right to play those games cannot legally be curtailed by the copyright owner after the fact.

Azrael

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #846 on: March 23, 2014, 02:41:11 PM »

LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #847 on: March 23, 2014, 03:01:16 PM »
Azrael, chances are you're already using linux in some form or another.  Ever use an android phone or tablet?  Yup.  That's linux under the hood.  There's even talk of building desktop PCs so they can boot either windows or android.  Fedora isn't too bad on the command line anymore.  Ubuntu all but eliminates the need for the command line for their desktop distros.  Upgrades to the next version with them are extremely simple.  Got windows apps you can't live without?  Install wine.  Believe it or not but I ran coh under ubuntu with wine installed.  120 FPS.  Worse I ever saw was about 50 FPS during a hami raid.  Same hardware under windows could make about 30 FPS.  With Hami raids, could go as low as 5 FPS under windows.  (Ouch!)

Like the look of your mac?  XFCE I believe has a theme to make it look almost identical to the mac.

While I'm thinking about it, you can get to the mac's command line now.  It's basically BSD unix under the hood.  Based on NeXT and not FreeBSD as many believe.
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Arcana

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #848 on: March 23, 2014, 07:38:20 PM »
While I'm thinking about it, you can get to the mac's command line now.  It's basically BSD unix under the hood.  Based on NeXT and not FreeBSD as many believe.
NeXTstep was built with a Mach kernel and a NetBSD-like OS layer above it to give it a BSD-Unix/POSIX like environment.  OSX is based on NeXTstep with significant modifications over the years.

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There's even talk of building desktop PCs so they can boot either windows or android.
I honestly have no idea why anyone thinks this is a good idea, at least in terms of a business manufacturing decision.  If you could wave a magic wand and make it happen, sure.  But the design decisions that go into making an Android platform and a Windows platform are completely different, and attempting to make something that is optimized for both is likely to fail, and something that is optimized for neither is definitely going to fail (as no one will want to buy it).

Desktop PCs can afford to throw hardware resources away on tasks, so running Android in a hypervisor (perhaps with some dedicated hardware support) makes sense to me.  Dual booting makes no sense to me.

LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #849 on: March 24, 2014, 04:32:50 AM »
NeXTstep was built with a Mach kernel and a NetBSD-like OS layer above it to give it a BSD-Unix/POSIX like environment.  OSX is based on NeXTstep with significant modifications over the years.

I honestly have no idea why anyone thinks this is a good idea, at least in terms of a business manufacturing decision.  If you could wave a magic wand and make it happen, sure.  But the design decisions that go into making an Android platform and a Windows platform are completely different, and attempting to make something that is optimized for both is likely to fail, and something that is optimized for neither is definitely going to fail (as no one will want to buy it).

Desktop PCs can afford to throw hardware resources away on tasks, so running Android in a hypervisor (perhaps with some dedicated hardware support) makes sense to me.  Dual booting makes no sense to me.

My guess would be the manufacturers of desktop hardware are trying to figure out how to keep their businesses afloat.  We are at a point where computing is moving away from the desktop/laptop model.  Some of you will no doubt think I'm crazy, but I don't believe the cell phone nor the tablet has much life left either.  Probably no more than 15 years tops.  We are moving into the world of implanted technology. 

While it's being pioneered for people with disabilities today, it will become a necessity for all as those who are paraplegic, for example, will not only return to full functionality but will be able to surpass those of us without the disability.  A person who cannot hear today will be able to hear better than a purely biological human.  The non-enhanced human if you will.  And, obviously, immersive gaming comes with this tech.  So does immersive movies. 

What did we do for the last 8 years?  Beat up our keyboards and mice and joysticks to do what?  Beat the hell out of hami, hellions, skulls, clockwork, etc. using a screen,  a window if you will into that world.  What I'm saying is in 20 or so years, we'll look back on CoH and wonder how much more of the game could it have been.  Imagine you flying over AP.  Feel the wind in your hair.  Look down to see your friends at the statue.  Having real time conversations instead of typing on a keyboard.  Punching Lord Recluse in the gut.  Getting punched back and feeling it.

Now the manufacturers of desktops/laptops are trying to figure out how to extend the life of the systems they know.  It's in vein.  The death of their businesses will happen so long as they ignore the future.  I fully expect them to try to make android work as a desktop OS.  Apple will try the same thing with IOS.  It's inevitable.

You don't know why they think it's a good idea?  Because they don't know what else to do.
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Arcana

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #850 on: March 24, 2014, 09:14:52 AM »
We are moving into the world of implanted technology.
That replaces conventional computing?  Not in fifteen years.  Its worth considering what most people ignore when they talk about a future with self-driving cars.  Want to take a guess as to the single biggest problem with self-driving cars?  No one knows how to insure them.  Without a way to regulate liability for a technology like that, it will never be a mainstream technology.  That's also why we don't have flying cars.  Its not that its hard to make a flying car.  Its hard to make a flying car that is impossible for a stupid driver to kill dozens of people on the ground with.

Some implanted technology is coming, and its inevitable that there will be certain applications that become highly ubiquitous.  But there's already a backlash to the loss of privacy associated with Google Glasses.  There are environments where I'm still required to surrender my camera phone: I would be literally unable to be a professional in the IT industry in my current capacity if I had the kind of technology implanted you're describing.  No one would allow me anywhere near them.  Those kinds of accommodations to technology tend to be the things futurists fail to account for when they attempt to project where technology is going and how fast it is going to get there.

No one, and I mean no one, is going to walk into an Apple store and have surgically implanted technology inserted into their bodies on the spot.  Just the practical reality of deploying bioimplanted technology is daunting and it would take years just to figure out the logistics.  And that's only after you find a company crazy enough to take on the liability issues associated with that.  We only just got past lawsuits against cell phone companies claiming the radiation from them was giving people brain cancer.

As a novelty, sure.  As ubiquitous sign-up-grandma technology?  Not for decades.

Cinnder

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #851 on: March 24, 2014, 11:09:25 PM »
Want to take a guess as to the single biggest problem with self-driving cars?

For me it would be the taking of the driving away from me.  For me that would be like a self-playing game or a self-reading book; it removes the element I like best about the activity.

Which is also why I've never understood PLing.

Kaos Arcanna

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #852 on: March 25, 2014, 01:46:29 AM »
For me it would be the taking of the driving away from me.  For me that would be like a self-playing game or a self-reading book; it removes the element I like best about the activity.

Which is also why I've never understood PLing.

On the other hand, it could be continued independence for older people who are no longer able to drive themselves. Or for people who are physically unable to drive themselves.


LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #853 on: March 25, 2014, 02:55:23 AM »
That replaces conventional computing?  Not in fifteen years.  Its worth considering what most people ignore when they talk about a future with self-driving cars.  Want to take a guess as to the single biggest problem with self-driving cars?  No one knows how to insure them.  Without a way to regulate liability for a technology like that, it will never be a mainstream technology.  That's also why we don't have flying cars.  Its not that its hard to make a flying car.  Its hard to make a flying car that is impossible for a stupid driver to kill dozens of people on the ground with.

Some implanted technology is coming, and its inevitable that there will be certain applications that become highly ubiquitous.  But there's already a backlash to the loss of privacy associated with Google Glasses.  There are environments where I'm still required to surrender my camera phone: I would be literally unable to be a professional in the IT industry in my current capacity if I had the kind of technology implanted you're describing.  No one would allow me anywhere near them.  Those kinds of accommodations to technology tend to be the things futurists fail to account for when they attempt to project where technology is going and how fast it is going to get there.

No one, and I mean no one, is going to walk into an Apple store and have surgically implanted technology inserted into their bodies on the spot.  Just the practical reality of deploying bioimplanted technology is daunting and it would take years just to figure out the logistics.  And that's only after you find a company crazy enough to take on the liability issues associated with that.  We only just got past lawsuits against cell phone companies claiming the radiation from them was giving people brain cancer.

As a novelty, sure.  As ubiquitous sign-up-grandma technology?  Not for decades.

I wouldn't be so sure of that.  Those that had a working body who lost part of it will likely want the freedom of having it back again.  Most would be willing to give anything to be able to hear or see or walk again.  15 years is a guestimate.  Might be 20.  No one really knows for sure.  What I do know is when the def guy can start hearing better than you, you'll have little choice but to have an ear implant just to keep up.

The backlash to surveillance is will be like most issues.  Short lived.  It will sink in importance to the masses with the next "crisis".  If you're worried about being watched them go ahead and barricade yourself in your home and stop using your debit/credit cards and no checks.  Today, you're watched like you'd never believe.  Advertisers watch your every purchase.  So does your credit/debit card company.  Banks watch your money movements.  Your employer watches you work.  Your email is scanned at work.  If you're using gmail, it is scanned for advertisement possibilities.  At least they admit to it.  Who knows what else they're doing in there.  Some companies go so far as to load key loggers on their machines.  Hell, merge the meta data from your cell phone, your credit/debit card, your emails, and your banking.  That alone gives an incredible picture into who you are.

As for the use of that tech, I liken those that make you surrender your camera phone to the record companies and riaa when mp3 first became downloadable.  Lawsuits slinging in all directions.  It was futile and short lived.  I expect laws will change to stop people from publishing rather than take the picture/movies.  Today they will fight tooth and nail to stop you from taking pictures/movies.  Tomorrow they will fight tooth and nail to stop you from publishing the pics/movies you took.  And an underground picture/movie "economy" will form just as it did with mp3s.

As for conventional computing, that's the same argument the mainframe guys said about Novell and Windows NT a few decades ago.   All I see is a move back to mainframes which we are now calling the cloud.  The mainframe will do the heavy work and be a centralized storehouse.  The tablet/cellphone of today and your implanted computer of tomorrow will be the interface and will take on light work and store data you choose not to put into the the cloud.  The back-end parts are already being built.
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LadyVamp

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #854 on: March 25, 2014, 03:02:19 AM »
For me it would be the taking of the driving away from me.  For me that would be like a self-playing game or a self-reading book; it removes the element I like best about the activity.

Which is also why I've never understood PLing.

You realize a movie is, in a sense, a self-reading book.  I don't think they will actually take driving away from us but rather pitch it as a new feature.  If you think about it, cruise control is pretty standard these days and many people use it but only on highways or interstates.  The cars will likely monitor your driving and if you drift too often or too far, the car will take over.  That will be the safety feature.  The convenience feature will be the option to turn it on at anytime which most will consider doing when on the interstate or highway.

As for PLing, I'm guessing you would say the journey if I asked what is more important.  The destination or the journey.
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Aggelakis

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #855 on: March 25, 2014, 07:42:56 AM »
The cars will likely monitor your driving and if you drift too often or too far, the car will take over.  That will be the safety feature.  The convenience feature will be the option to turn it on at anytime which most will consider doing when on the interstate or highway.
They already have cars that monitor your driving. There are cars that monitor your driving so closely and carefully that if you get too close to something in front of you, it will apply your brakes for you. If you come up to something stopped at too fast a speed, it will STOP your car for you - some of the new Mercedes can do it in a matter of a couple seconds: faster than it would take you to notice the thing, move your foot from the gas to the brake, and begin applying the brakes. Some cars even monitor when going in reverse - never again back into that pole you can't see out your back window!

I have something a step down from that, lights on my side mirrors that go on when something is in my blind spot. A rear-view camera just above my license plate to allow me to see stuff behind me. Not automated, but the poor (wo)man's version. :)

I work in the auto industry, this stuff is fascinating and exciting and technology improvements are moving at breakneck speed!
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JanessaVR

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #856 on: March 25, 2014, 07:50:49 AM »
If you're worried about being watched them go ahead and barricade yourself in your home and stop using your debit/credit cards and no checks.
Actually, post-cryostasis for me (most likely), in the far future, this is in fact exactly what I plan on doing.  There won't be any privacy anywhere in realspace, so I'm moving into virtual space - permanently.

Cinnder

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #857 on: March 25, 2014, 08:48:06 AM »
On the other hand, it could be continued independence for older people who are no longer able to drive themselves. Or for people who are physically unable to drive themselves.

Oh yeah, I'm sure it can help a bunch of folks -- as long as it's optional.  Heck, I won't even buy a car with automatic transmission.  Though I can certainly see the advantages of some of the cool new safety features mentioned above.

You realize a movie is, in a sense, a self-reading book.

I couldn't disagree more.  There are many media for presenting stories: oral, written, stage, film, game...  Each has its own advantages, style options, etc.  There are some books that would never work as films.  Hasn't stopped Hollywood from making movies of them, of course. :-)

As for PLing, I'm guessing you would say the journey if I asked what is more important.  The destination or the journey.

OK, fair enough.  You're right about how I'd answer that question.  Guess same could be applied to driving: some folks might just want to get there.

Anyway, sorry about the multiple threadjacks in a single post.


Felderburg

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #858 on: March 25, 2014, 02:52:36 PM »
I used CIT before they even joined the Titan network! But then I left for a long ol' time, and came back. Now I edit the wiki.

I'm working on sorting the Lore AMAs so that questions are easily found and linked: http://paragonwiki.com/wiki/Lore_AMA/Sorted Tell me what you think!

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Arcana

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Re: OK, what now? I need a private server or the ability to run my own.
« Reply #859 on: March 25, 2014, 06:22:34 PM »
I wouldn't be so sure of that.  Those that had a working body who lost part of it will likely want the freedom of having it back again.
You are conflating replacement body parts which we already have and are developing better versions of, and augmentation technology which is still very limited in scope.  And those people make a conscious effort, when its necessary, to take the risks associated with implantation surgery for the benefits thereof.  There's a presumption that those risks are reasonable risks.  If something goes wrong when someone is trying to get an iPod implanted, their relatives are not always going to take the position that risk was reasonable.