Author Topic: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope  (Read 13092 times)

Harermuir

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I dont want to kill any hope here. I dont want to say that you should do nothing because anything you will do is already doomed to failure. But still ...

The main issue with the discontinuation of the game of the ip is, from that I know, not the lack of buyer, but the will of NCsoft to not sell anything around one of their butchered MMORPG. Any MMORPG who has been drop recently has found another editor. Trying to find a buyer when their is nothing to sell is a fight that we have already lose. Further, we will be waiting for news about negotiation, which we will neither have but in the very unlikely case that an aggreement is found. And during this time, we will be keeping low.

Well, i just want someone to give me a little more hope and I appreciate all the time and effort put toward the goal of reviving the game.

Edit : http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,6753.0.html
Ok, i ve got hope :)
« Last Edit: December 05, 2012, 10:18:24 AM by Harermuir »

The Fifth Horseman

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting
« Reply #1 on: December 05, 2012, 08:49:47 AM »
It's not over till we say it's over or we get the City back.
We were heroes. We were villains. At the end of the world we all fought as one. It's what we did that defines us.
The end occurred pretty much as we predicted: all servers redlining until midnight... and then no servers to go around.

Somewhere beyond time and space, if you look hard you might find a flash of silver trailing crimson: a lone lost Spartan on his way home.

Victoria Victrix

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2012, 09:38:02 AM »
I will go down with this ship.  I won't put my hands up in surrender.  There will be no white flag above my door.  I'm in love, and always will be.  Dido

Rae

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OzonePrime

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting
« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2012, 12:57:32 PM »
It's not over till we say it's over or we get the City back.
My sentiments exactly!

Quinch

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NCsoft's resistance in selling, well, anything is why we went to Disney first, in fact - the consequences of refusal {and I don't mean in any kind of illegal sense} would be too obviously severe even for NCsoft's execs to ignore, especially PR and investor-wise.

And like it's already been mentioned, it looks like #savecoh managed to erode at least some of the muleheadedness, now that they're backtracking with "nothing's been decided".

Victoria Victrix

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We are front page on slashdot and MMORPG.com
We are middle page bleedingcool.com

The Korean Times article is literally being linked all over the world.
I will go down with this ship.  I won't put my hands up in surrender.  There will be no white flag above my door.  I'm in love, and always will be.  Dido

Kistulot

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We are front page on slashdot and MMORPG.com
We are middle page bleedingcool.com

The Korean Times article is literally being linked all over the world.

I want to thank you for how much you've done to help with this movement, to get it where it is today.

You've gotten lots of thumbs up, but I havent had the chance yet personally... thank you :)
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Vasarto

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Well yes, Sometimes a news story like this one can tend to fly around a lot.
Depending on the person who tells the story it can either be featured in an isolated article or be spread around. Depending on how relevant the topic is to the readers and how compelling the words are by the one being interviewed. In our case we have an accomplished writer AND something relevant to the interests of 100% of those whom would read it. All web sites being that of Gaming web sites from what I see.

Gaming news is always relevant and a lot of people HATE NCSOFT and the games they make including cox. So even though they do not like cox. They still delight in reading such a thing because than it gives them something else to tweet or say about it to another guy like...that &&$&$ NCshit company is failing lol. That terrible company even pisems off their own customers who play their crappy games lulz!

So as you can see even people who are like that can even have something to talk about. Even Negative talk like that still spreads interest and lets people know what we are doing thus gaining more and more notice.

We are very lucky to have people like that and people like the Super High caffine charged typists who have been tweeting, Emailing, facebook and sending letters to Disney and making posts in other internet forums etc to run amok around the web like some of we have here lol. 

Taceus Jiwede

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2012, 04:57:32 AM »
It's not over till we say it's over or we get the City back.

Hoorah!

Victoria Victrix

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Rae

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2012, 09:26:23 AM »
Between this, and the Korean article, I'm happier than I've been in freakin' months.  ;D
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johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #12 on: December 07, 2012, 05:02:28 PM »
"We must be the change we wish to see in the world." -- Mahatma Gandhi         "In every generation there has to be some fool who will speak the truth as he sees it." -- Boris Pasternak
"Where They Have Burned Books They Will End In Burning Human Beings" -- Heinrich Heine

johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #13 on: December 07, 2012, 06:03:33 PM »
BTW, Rae, do you or others in Team Wildcard think there would be any use in us writing NCSoft, asking them to sell the rights to CoH rather than leaving it unused and buried in their vaults?  I don't expect for them to pull out a chair for us at the negotiating table, but surely this much interest must count for something.

I remember from the mid-1970s when I did most of my superhero comicbook reading that Stan Lee and others at Marvel and their counterparts at DC took time to answer fan letters.  Apart from our recent ire over the recent Sunset, I've been suprised at how standoffish NCSoft has seemed regarding its customers and fans.
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Rae

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #14 on: December 07, 2012, 08:15:26 PM »
BTW, Rae, do you or others in Team Wildcard think there would be any use in us writing NCSoft, asking them to sell the rights to CoH rather than leaving it unused and buried in their vaults?  I don't expect for them to pull out a chair for us at the negotiating table, but surely this much interest must count for something.

Erm. I'm not sure, honestly. Given the amount of flack they're getting on FB/Twitter etc., it might be worth leaving them be for the meantime. But honestly I couldn't tell you one way or the other if it might be worth doing.

Quinch, Ammon, VV? Any thoughts?
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johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2012, 09:18:20 PM »
I'm not sure if this has any bearing.  While I'm vastly encouraged by the Korean Times article, I note this earlier statement is still up:  http://us.ncsoft.com/en/news/response-to-city-of-heroes-player-and-fan-suggestions.html and remains the second item of official NCSoft News: http://us.ncsoft.com/en/news/
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Victoria Victrix

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2012, 01:05:21 AM »
Well the "we have not settled anything" statement can be read either as another placating motion to get us to shut up, OR the equivalent of a slap in the face from a senior executive at the NCSoft Main HQ to whatever idiot issued the original statements.

Obviously, I am hoping the latter.  But we have no way of knowing which it might be.
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dwturducken

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2012, 01:45:10 AM »
Either one is a slap to someone, IMHO.
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2012, 02:01:42 AM »
Well the "we have not settled anything" statement can be read either as another placating motion to get us to shut up, OR the equivalent of a slap in the face from a senior executive at the NCSoft Main HQ to whatever idiot issued the original statements.

Obviously, I am hoping the latter.  But we have no way of knowing which it might be.

I am hoping as you are that the more recent statement represents a realignment in focus resulting in the strategic decision to sell the IP and rights to CoH.

May I be a gushing fan again to say how much I liked what you had to say in the Korean Times article?
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Quinch

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2012, 06:19:58 AM »
Erm. I'm not sure, honestly. Given the amount of flack they're getting on FB/Twitter etc., it might be worth leaving them be for the meantime. But honestly I couldn't tell you one way or the other if it might be worth doing.

Quinch, Ammon, VV? Any thoughts?

I think it depends on the message of the letter - while politeness is an absolute must, I believe it wouldn't hurt to remind them, as the same players who've been giving them so much grief, a genuine effort to undo the harm caused to us might even be reciprocated, or at the very least cause the harm itself from being returned at them.

johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2012, 07:36:36 AM »
I think it depends on the message of the letter - while politeness is an absolute must, I believe it wouldn't hurt to remind them, as the same players who've been giving them so much grief, a genuine effort to undo the harm caused to us might even be reciprocated, or at the very least cause the harm itself from being returned at them.

While some won't--you can't kick 50,000-150,000 people, some of them kids, in the teeth and walk away scott free--but I'd be willing to let bygones by bygone if NCSoft were to sell the IP.   If they don't I'll consider them donkey pancake (I can scarcely believe I just typed "pancake" for "flop".)  I feel that NCSoft already missed at least one Golden Opportunity to work with the fans/players/community.   I am even surprised by it, since I think (thought) Korean culture valued working together harmoniously even more highly than, say, the U.S.  Putting my ignorance to the side, how best Quinch can we relay such a message?

I'll confess to not understanding why NCSoft would be reticent to sell the City of Heroes IP and rights, especially now after Sunset and the ending of all CoH related contractual obligations.  They angled for more CoH customers with Free to Play, free subscription time for any of us getting friends to subscribe, and any other marketing efforts I may well be unaware of.  Apart from their "strategic realignment of focus" I've presumed CoH wasn't sufficiently profitable for the publisher, despite running in the black.  If our numbers are too few to meet their profit goals, it seems logical that City of Heroes under a different publisher would at most take away miniscule market share from their ventures and perhaps more likely have no negative impact at all.

Someone on these forums once posted to say there were significant legal expenses involved in selling an Intellectual Property, positing that this alone might have made it not cost-effective for NCSoft to sell.  Someone (perhaps the same person) noted the combined value of ALL IP's owned by NCSoft tallied at around $2 million (USD).  Hats off to the Finance and Business women and men who understand such things.  I hope they're willing to come back and explain again, now that we have a LOT more people reading these forums.

I know some have had concerns that NCSoft would not sell the IP merely from fear that another publisher would meet with better success and that that alone would be an embarrassment.  I suppose that is a risk.  But most of the businessmen and women I've met don't feel embarrassed at all about making money and are willing to overlook a great deal to do so.  I may be in error, but NCSoft is a corporation with international offices operating in the global market of MMO customers; as such I'd expect its business practices to rise above any one culture.  Am I a fool for thinking this?  Heck, if they'd adhered to their vision statement of promoting human happiness, we'd all still be playing CoH.

Sorry for the long rant.  I'm still trying to understand as well as figure out approaches to getting CoH back.  (and yeah by CoH I mean the dev team too!  I want them with us even if it takes a while to rebuild.)
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Victoria Victrix

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2012, 10:24:22 AM »
I believe what you are thinking of as "significant legal expenses" were, in fact, that I was told that there were "significant legal ENTANGLEMENTS" involved in selling CoH while it was still live, and that no one sane would sign off on the liabilities implied with taking those on.  Those entanglements and liabilities, according to what I and Fansy were told, literally evaporated when the game when down.
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johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2012, 11:40:28 AM »
I believe what you are thinking of as "significant legal expenses" were, in fact, that I was told that there were "significant legal ENTANGLEMENTS" involved in selling CoH while it was still live, and that no one sane would sign off on the liabilities implied with taking those on.  Those entanglements and liabilities, according to what I and Fansy were told, literally evaporated when the game when down.

Yes, that was my understanding as well, everything you've said here.  Like everyone, I'm hoping that after CoH Sunset and the resulting end of all related contracts that NCSoft is in a position now to sell the IP.  What I read was awhile ago, and I don't have any experience or knowledge related to the costs, monetary or otherwise, and process in selling an IP.  That's why I was asking the business people to chime in.  I know an author has experience and likely expertise in selling intellectual properties.  I'm glad for you, Fansy, and many others, and hope we soon (measured in months) have CoH back again.
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CG

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2012, 03:27:24 PM »
I believe what you are thinking of as "significant legal expenses" were, in fact, that I was told that there were "significant legal ENTANGLEMENTS" involved in selling CoH while it was still live, and that no one sane would sign off on the liabilities implied with taking those on.  Those entanglements and liabilities, according to what I and Fansy were told, literally evaporated when the game when down.
At some point in the future, when it is appropriate to do so, I would love to know the behind the scenes story.

johnrobey

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #24 on: December 08, 2012, 06:40:21 PM »
At some point in the future, when it is appropriate to do so, I would love to know the behind the scenes story.

Me too! But I think we get to know this only after the book and movie rights have been sold.   ;) 

(ha ha, only 1/2 kidding or HHO1/2K from old amatuer press association days aka fanzines produced with mimeo- and dittograph machines.  Yes, kids, your ancestors really did use flint, clubs and crudely sharpened sticks.)
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FlyingCarcass

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2012, 11:42:55 PM »
While this probably doesn't pertain to saving CoH, Disney Interactive just bought out a Korean online game developer, which suggests to me that they may be looking to expand their online gaming offerings.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/disney-buys-koreas-studioex-6401373


Tanglefoe

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2012, 12:27:58 AM »
While this probably doesn't pertain to saving CoH, Disney Interactive just bought out a Korean online game developer, which suggests to me that they may be looking to expand their online gaming offerings.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/disney-buys-koreas-studioex-6401373

Very interesting!

TimtheEnchanter

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2012, 02:36:43 AM »
While this probably doesn't pertain to saving CoH, Disney Interactive just bought out a Korean online game developer, which suggests to me that they may be looking to expand their online gaming offerings.

http://www.gamespot.com/news/disney-buys-koreas-studioex-6401373

They're going to use the developer to produce a Marvel F2P game?

Hm. That's... disheartening.

Surelle

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #28 on: December 12, 2012, 03:23:12 AM »
They're going to use the developer to produce a Marvel F2P game?

Hm. That's... disheartening.

Well, it could be worse:  They could be hiring NCSoft!   :P

FlyingCarcass

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #29 on: December 12, 2012, 03:26:44 AM »
They're going to use the developer to produce a Marvel F2P game?

Hm. That's... disheartening.

I believe this is the game they're referring to:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/new-marvel-online-game-set-for-asian-regions-6400003

It's a MOBA... different genre than CoH.

Like I said, the news probably doesn't pertain to CoH in any way, but the fact that they're acquiring Asian assets and expanding their business has me hopeful they'll consider CoH.

Surelle

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2012, 03:33:59 AM »
I believe this is the game they're referring to:
http://www.gamespot.com/news/new-marvel-online-game-set-for-asian-regions-6400003

It's a MOBA... different genre than CoH.

Like I said, the news probably doesn't pertain to CoH in any way, but the fact that they're acquiring Asian assets and expanding their business has me hopeful they'll consider CoH.

The main problems being their "new direction" stems from a Korean team that does Facebook games, and two of their other new online games are youngster kiddie fare based on the Cars and Toy Story franchises.  Let's hope they want to branch out beyond new F2P Marvel battle arenas and Pixar to include an 8 1/2 year old MMORPG that currently has no dev team.... 

TimtheEnchanter

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2012, 03:42:06 AM »
The main problems being their "new direction" stems from a Korean team that does Facebook games, and two of their other new online games are youngster kiddie fare based on the Cars and Toy Story franchises.  Let's hope they want to branch out beyond new F2P Marvel battle arenas and Pixar to include an 8 1/2 year old MMORPG that currently has no dev team....

My concern is that they just made a big investment to push Marvel gaming forward at all, not about what kind of game it is. It just makes the CoH attempt bad timing, depending on how expensive the sale was.

A bigger obsession with kiddie gaming is hardly a "new direction" though. That's just staying on the same road and putting the pedal to the floor.

Arkasas

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Re: Why this task force may already has failed before even starting UPDATE hope
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2012, 04:00:59 AM »
The main problems being their "new direction" stems from a Korean team that does Facebook games, and two of their other new online games are youngster kiddie fare based on the Cars and Toy Story franchises.  Let's hope they want to branch out beyond new F2P Marvel battle arenas and Pixar to include an 8 1/2 year old MMORPG that currently has no dev team....

Their MMORPG is 9 years old, although with a dev team. But our community is stronger.

Victoria Victrix

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The long haul
« Reply #33 on: December 12, 2012, 06:12:39 AM »
Remember folks, this is a marathon, not a sprint.

We are in this for the long haul.  If we actually GET Disney, their movement will be glacial.  By the time money exchanges hands, this current acquisition will be a blip in the distance.

We already have other things moving.  Brian Clayton is going to talk to his contacts at Disney Interactive and see if they are even aware of us. 

And we have the Colbert Gambit.  If we manage to engage Stephen Colbert, we will GET Disney's attention.  In fact, we might have investors/buyers coming to US.

Don't get discouraged, Team Wildcard is not by any means done yet.

As old Winnie said, "Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."
I will go down with this ship.  I won't put my hands up in surrender.  There will be no white flag above my door.  I'm in love, and always will be.  Dido