Author Topic: is there anything like insp?  (Read 14310 times)

MomentaryGrace

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is there anything like insp?
« on: December 12, 2012, 12:45:35 AM »
So I'm level 8, free sword melee, trying to beat this boss Talos. I can't beat him. I've gotten killed a dozen times.

What do I do? If it was CoH I'd get insps but I don't know if there's anything like that in Champions.

?


mg

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Epelesker

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2012, 02:31:18 AM »
If you're looking for consumables, I don't think you can really buy your first recovery items with Resources until Lv11, especially if you used your recovery patches from the starter kit. There's boosts you can buy with Zen, but that's involving real money.

This game's version of inspirations are drops that are automatically used if you go near them.

* Red increase your power.
* Yellow increases your defense.
* Green and blue recover a small amount of HP or Energy, respectively.
* Special drops (white) combine two/multiple effects from the above.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Talos is a pain. Luckily, you don't have to lower his HP completely to win.

Stunrunner

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2012, 02:49:34 AM »
I'm finding that at the low levels, ranged toons take care of these bosses better than melees.  Talos was laughably easy with my archer.  Kevin Poe was a little tougher, but still easier than with my punchbot.

Epelesker's right; the buff drops here are more like arcade game buffs, where something drops on the screen and you have to run over it to consume it, and they disappear after thirty seconds if you don't touch them.  So far there doesn't seem to be a way to 'pop Skittles' before bosses in this game.  But I'm only at lvl 12 right now, so that may change.

Tenzhi

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2012, 05:06:50 AM »
Do you not have a slotted defensive ability (other than Lightning Reflexes, which barely counts as one in the early levels)?  If not, my advice would be to go to the Powerhouse and Undo a power and replace it with a slotted defensive ability - Regeneration, Invulnerability, Personal Force Field, and Defiance will all do wonders for your survivability.

If you're using Lightning Reflexes, I can only suggest outlevelling the mission a bit.  I hear Lightning Reflexes can get a LOT better later on, but I have yet to get one to a significant level.

Oh, and on the off chance you didn't - did you make sure to equip yourself?  The initial visit to the Powerhouse gets you a supply kit with three pieces of Primary gear and the missions up to the one with Talos tend to allow you to fill up your Secondary slots which is important to survival.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Epelesker

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2012, 05:32:53 AM »
So far there doesn't seem to be a way to 'pop Skittles' before bosses in this game.  But I'm only at lvl 12 right now, so that may change.
The only thing close to that is the [Heroic Might] buff item which can be bought in the Z-Store as a 4 or 10 pack. They last a longer time than our "reds" did in CoH, but they can't be stacked at all.

Kaiser Tarantula

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2012, 07:11:22 AM »
A lot of people are neglecting devices.  There are a few devices you can pick up in the tutorial that can make Talos a breeze.  Try getting a Qularr Hive Seed, a Qularr Mutagen, and a couple packs of Qularr mines.  Make liberal use of them in the Talos and Kevin Poe fights.  They're great for brutalizing your first couple supervillains, especially if you're not a tank and don't have a defensive passive yet.

Every time you run the Battle of the Ironclad event in the tutorial, you can pick up a Low-Power Healing Patch from the reward drops.  I suggest running it a couple times to farm up 3-4 patches.  Having a quickie self-heal for emergencies can do wonders for your survivability.

Devices continue to be useful throughout the game, and many missions drop devices that are suited to that particular mish.  For instance, in Whiteout you can pick up H.O.C.K.E.Y.s and Personal Field Generators, which provide you with clicky defensive abilities, as well as a Sidekick - the Steelhead Soldier.  Beating up the higher-ranking (villain/master villain) members of the westside gangs might give you a Gang War summon.

Don't hoard devices.  They're a lot like temporary powers - use 'em, abuse 'em, discard 'em when they run out.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 07:17:09 AM by Kaiser Tarantula »

Tenzhi

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2012, 07:25:51 AM »
Don't hoard devices.  They're a lot like temporary powers - use 'em, abuse 'em, discard 'em when they run out.

I always hoarded Temp powers.  Of course, I only used Inspirations as a last resort, too.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

Ezuka

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2012, 07:30:59 AM »
I always hoarded Temp powers.  Of course, I only used Inspirations as a last resort, too.

Same here. Out of all the time I spent CoH, I never really got over my hoarding of insp. I always had that fear that'd I'd use an insp, and I'd need it later. :P
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 01:35:33 PM by Ezuka »

JRVthatsME

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2012, 01:25:16 PM »
@ MomentaryGrace

Since you are only at the end of the tutorial some of the advice here wont be available to you yet. I'm guessing that since you're just trying out this game to see if you'll like it that you're playing a character with The Blade Archetype. Anyway at level 8 you have 2 more powers available to you that will help you out in this battle. To train in them click on the lightning bolt symbol at the top left corner of your mini-map. Way of the Warrior is essentially an auto power that boost you combat power and your defecive abilities. Thunderbolt Lunge is a ranged jump attack that will let you close in on him quickly and hit him. You can also take a Talent that can boost your stats. I'd pick the one that boost your DEX by 8 points.

Next on your keyboard press the ESC key, then click options and select the controls tabe. Now enter these settings to make the gameply closer to how it was in CoH which should help you get the hang of the fighting better. I did put alway face forward ON myself because I found it easier to turn around that way. Also set Auto Attack to Toggle, Never Cancels to make your energy builder attack Reapers Touch behave like a toggle power so you can just click it on and it will always hit your selected target if he's within melee range without you having to pay attention to it. (it will toggle off every time you go to a new map/zone).

On your keyboard press I to open your inventory. Inside there is a metal chest, double click on it to open it. This will give you some starting gear and you can just double click on each armor type item to equip it. It will also give you some devices like a heal over time when used device and you probably have some consumable buff devices that you picked up while fighting the Qular. At the bottom right corner of your screen there are 5 slots where you put these devices so that you can click on them to use them and if you hover your mouse pointer over one of them it will tell you what the device does.

Battle Strategy
2 things Talos can't do. 1 he can't heal at all unless you get defeated. 2. He can't leave that room. So use your Thunderbolt Lunge attack to charge in at him (make sure your Reapers Touch attack is toggles on) and keep spaming your Reapers Caress attack on him as on every 3rd hit it does a nice chunk of damage and will apply the Bleed damage over time debuff to him. Anytime you see a Boom sign or any other kind of sign appear above his head it means he's charging up 1 of his special attacks to hit you with. When you see this hold down the SHIFT key on your keyboard until after he hits you with that attack to block it. When you get down to about 1/2 your health run back the way you came until your out of his attack range (he can't follow you out of that room) and wait until your health is full again (he can't heal unless he defeets you).

This advice should allow you to beat him even if you don't have any buff devices left. If you have paid for gold membership and are playing a Freeform Character instead of the blade Archetype you may want to get some advice on what powers to take. I have some helpful info in the guide I made that might help you choose.

Best of luck when you next face him.

Epelesker

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2012, 08:06:50 PM »
Waylon Talos isn't in the tutorial, J-- you're mixing him up with Black Talon.

Or maybe I'm reading it wrong.

Kaiser Tarantula

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2012, 08:34:26 PM »
Black Talon is at the end of the tutorial. Wayland Talos is the first supervillain you face outside of the tutorial, during the New Purple Gang story arc from Kodiak.  Talos is hard, but you only have to get him down past half-health, and then he'll turn 'friendly' and you have to speak to him.

dwturducken

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2012, 09:03:53 PM »
I "beat" him once with my tank, but I did die a few times. I think it took me a couple of tries to start picking off the minions and lieutenants, first. It didn't make it easier, just less deathy.

I thought it was funny that his name was Talos. It got me looking for more "Easter egg" references, like that.
I wouldn't use the word "replace," but there's no word for "take over for you and make everything better almost immediately," so we just say "replace."

thunderforce

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #12 on: December 13, 2012, 12:22:53 AM »
Same here. Out of all the time I spent CoH, I never really got over my hoarding of insp. I always had that fear that'd I'd use an insp, and I'd need it later. :P

Quite the opposite. I had F2-F6 as hotkeys for popping a green, a purple-or-orange, a blue, a Break Free, and a red-or-yellow; but also F1 and Shift-F1 to pop the bottom and top inspos in the left-hand column (of course, one of these is the normal function of F1, yes) and always kept empty spaces in that column. If (once the other columns are stocked) you just pop everything as it drops, you're almost constantly under the effect of one or two inspos, and that's a nice place to be.

Tenzhi

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2012, 05:20:25 AM »
Quite the opposite. I had F2-F6 as hotkeys for popping a green, a purple-or-orange, a blue, a Break Free, and a red-or-yellow; but also F1 and Shift-F1 to pop the bottom and top inspos in the left-hand column (of course, one of these is the normal function of F1, yes) and always kept empty spaces in that column. If (once the other columns are stocked) you just pop everything as it drops, you're almost constantly under the effect of one or two inspos, and that's a nice place to be.

I've gone through entire missions and only picked up 1-3 Inspirations, which is one of the reasons I didn't depend on them.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

MomentaryGrace

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #14 on: December 13, 2012, 11:13:57 PM »
Thanks for the replies, info and advice, particularly @JRVthatsME - your detailed description of strategy was great. :)


Off to give it another, hopefully more successful, shot.

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JRVthatsME

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #15 on: December 14, 2012, 04:59:56 PM »
Well I did mistake the villain for black talon from the tutorial but most of what I said would still apply. Something that you can try is throwing some of the gas tanks at him from a distance and there are some spots in that room where you can get away from him for a while if you get him to the other side of the room first (especially if you can fly).

JaguarX

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #16 on: December 14, 2012, 05:15:41 PM »
yeah remember to block at charge up power cues especially at early levels (without defensive powers and LR early levels). Dont wait until unti quarter of health bar to start blocking because be then ya usually dead meat anyways and only prolonging near certain death. Talos, is pretty simple one you figure out when to block. A couple of his moves will kill your health quickly if you are not careful, but other moves are light hitting. During those times, you should be hitting him with everything you got. The bosses in this game usually dont regenerate health as fast as they did in COX, so you can take your time and wear him down to half level.

DOnt be afraid to use the entire room for cover to get a breather. Many think that in order ot beat somethign they always have to go balls to the wall man to man with the enemy and depending on set up, you can do it if you have a strong slotted defensive passive, by all means. But if you dont, you'll find yourself faceplanting a bit going to fist to fist with eevery big villain you come across. It may be late now but hope you beat him. Talos is one of the easiest villians ot beat, he doesnt do too much damage, his charge powers are easy to spot and block in time if you must, and you only have to get him half way. If you have trouble with Talos, take a look at the build and strategy being used and make the changes needed. remember dont be afraid to take powers to get you through low levels even if you dont plan on keeping them. Respecs are cheap and easy especially if it's the last few powers chosen. If you struggle with Talos, Poe is going to be horror for you. Fix it now, and be greatful that you did later. As Tenz. said, dont depend on LR early levels, it's weak. Later levels, it's a very good solid slotted passive defense power.

blackjak

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #17 on: December 14, 2012, 05:22:34 PM »
I beat hin first try with both my tanks. He can't reach the jets or whatever on the left side of the room. Rest up there.
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JaguarX

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #18 on: December 14, 2012, 05:53:35 PM »
I beat hin first try with both my tanks. He can't reach the jets or whatever on the left side of the room. Rest up there.

Yeah I never came close to dying while fighting this guy before on anytoon, even my first encounter.

Kaiser Tarantula

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #19 on: December 14, 2012, 06:03:25 PM »
One important thing to realize about Wayland Talos - he begins the fight distracted.  Do not play it safe, do not hold resources in reserve.  If you've got Strength for a Superstat, grab the heaviest thing you can find from the other side of the room, and hurl it at him to start the fight off.  If you've got a chargeable ranged attack, let him have a fully-charged blast to the back of the head.  Bum-rush him -  remember, he only needs to go down to around half-health and then he'll give up and let you talk to him.  Make the fight brutal and short.

If the fight goes against you, remember there's a door between Talos and the rest of the map.  If you botch up and he starts kicking your rear,  get some distance from him, throw on your Purple Gang disguise, and walk through the door you entered.  Wayland Talos can't follow you, and with the disguise, the Purple Gangers on the other side won't be hostile.  You can rest up, then go back and kick his head in.  I don't know whether this resets his health or not, but worst-case-scenario is you get a do-over.  Best-case-scenario is that you can chip him down a little at a time.

To be honest, I often just cut down the swath of goons in the first room after using my disguise to get past the mission door.  There's not that many, they're not that hard, and that's more loot from an otherwise stingy mission.  If you do that, you don't even need to put on the disguise if you have to run from Talos - everyone in the other room's already dead.
« Last Edit: December 14, 2012, 08:24:57 PM by Kaiser Tarantula »

Tenzhi

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #20 on: December 15, 2012, 05:33:49 AM »
I've attempted fighting the guys in the other room a few times after curb-stomping Talos and they tend to overwhelm me with sheer numbers.  It's a smallish room and difficult to avoid aggroing all of them, and as I recall there are two "bosses", three or four "lieutenants", and something like eight to twelve "minions".  They easily out-damage Talos if they dogpile you all at once.
When you insult someone by calling them a "pig" or a "dog" you aren't maligning pigs and dogs everywhere.  The same is true of any term used as an insult.

JaguarX

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #21 on: December 15, 2012, 05:41:41 AM »
I've attempted fighting the guys in the other room a few times after curb-stomping Talos and they tend to overwhelm me with sheer numbers.  It's a smallish room and difficult to avoid aggroing all of them, and as I recall there are two "bosses", three or four "lieutenants", and something like eight to twelve "minions".  They easily out-damage Talos if they dogpile you all at once.

Easiest way I found to beat them(melee toon) is enter the room, then go to the far right corner. There is about three, two LTs and a minion, *ahem I mean two villians and a henchment there. Aggro them. one of the master villains and a henchmen will join the fight, or about half the room. Use the box to funnel them and beat them down. Then after you take those down, take ya time with the other side which should be about the same as the first group. And then with little effort the room is cleared. Easy as pie.

Going in there balls to the wall, have to be careful have a halfway sturdy for low level toon for that method. Some of my toons succeeded using the direct method too but those jokers when together do some damage. 

General Idiot

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Re: is there anything like insp?
« Reply #22 on: December 15, 2012, 03:58:15 PM »
Waylon Talos isn't in the tutorial, J-- you're mixing him up with Black Talon.

Don't think he is but it's worth mentioning anyway - Black Talon is one of the harder singleplayer fights in the game IMO, because of an oversight on the devs' part. See, originally the misisons in the tutorial gave you gear to equip. They don't anymore, but Black Talon is still balanced assuming you have that gear. Since you don't, he easily overpowers you if you fail to block at the right moments.

Wayland Talos, on the other hand, is much easier or at least I found him to be. One thing to note though, he has an electricity power called Sparkstorm, which is a pbaoe maintain. In layman's terms, while using it he won't move but will do significant damage to you if you're in melee with him. Watch for the yellow lightning bolts coming off him and run back out of range to avoid the damage, or just attack him from range to begin with if you can. If you're melee, I think some of the archetypes have a lunge power (Thunderbolt lunge, mighty leap, pounce, or similar powers in every set that has melee powers) you can use that to close the distance immediately as he stops.


Two other things also worth noting, even as an archetype you do still have to train to receive powers. Top left button on the minimap, the one with the lightning bolt icon, will bring up the power window and at the bottom of that there's a train button. Also, don't forget to equip any gear you might have from earlier missions. It's like enhancements in CoH, does nothing if you don't equip it. When starting out look for gear that has stats on it in bolt yellow font instead of the standard white. The ones displayed such are your primary or secondary super stats, and give you a bonus to damage for having lots of them. In general, just grabbing anything with more super stats on it than what you have is a viable idea right up to 40. By the time you get there you'll probably have picked up enough to know what to do at that point. :)