Author Topic: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!  (Read 52715 times)

JaguarX

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2013, 06:26:34 AM »
Well, remember that Valiance Online appeared out of nowhere, made some statements that made it sound dubious that they knew anything about CoH at all, and then vanished off the face of the earth for a few months.  What I think happened - and this is just me speculating wildly - is that if TPP said anything, it's probably from that "vanished off the face of the earth" period.  Heck, I thought they were a fly-by-night scam at that point, too, and posted as such.  But that was before they reappeared and started showing off stuff (most notably that playable alpha, which is still being updated every week or so) like gangbusters.

It could turn out to be terrible, of course.  It's a team of complete unknowns who aren't as connected to the Titan community as TPP or H&V.  But there's a good chance that it'll be done first, so it's worth keeping an eye on.

yeah.

Mazz vs The World

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2013, 05:31:51 PM »
While VO may not have the popularity of the Titan Community it does have a Facebook page with lots of ex COH players who give advice and they are constantly updating the community in regard to whats going on. If this is all for a scam then someone is really taking to much time and development to scam people. I honestly think VO is great and if I am being completely honest they have way more to show than the others at this point. So if there is anything close to bringing COH back in any aspect it's VO, regardless of what TPP or H&V have to say towards it. That's my two cents as far as someone starting this thread thank you and even though you cross posts it served it's purpose and finally got a somewhat update as far as what's going on. I think people don't realize not everyone likes reading through constant babble for an update so thak you!

Angel Phoenix77

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #22 on: July 09, 2013, 03:21:58 AM »
may I ask which of the nc games closed last before city of. I ask because I found real emus 's for exxteal, auto assault, and tabula rasa. If I had this info I could calculate how much time it would take for city of to be able to get a emu.
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DarkCurrent

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2013, 03:49:18 AM »
While VO may not have the popularity of the Titan Community it does have a Facebook page with lots of ex COH players who give advice and they are constantly updating the community in regard to whats going on. If this is all for a scam then someone is really taking to much time and development to scam people. I honestly think VO is great and if I am being completely honest they have way more to show than the others at this point. So if there is anything close to bringing COH back in any aspect it's VO, regardless of what TPP or H&V have to say towards it. That's my two cents as far as someone starting this thread thank you and even though you cross posts it served it's purpose and finally got a somewhat update as far as what's going on. I think people don't realize not everyone likes reading through constant babble for an update so thak you!

I'm excited by what I'm seeing and reading over there.  I've downloaded and installed their pre-alpha package and can say I have seen no evidence of a scam.  It's sure looks like a real game under real development.  So for me I don't care that the developers aren't card carrying members of The Forum Cartel from the old boards.  If post count were a sign of development ability, then a certain poster who put her foot in her mouth and swallowed on 7/4 would have published a dozen MMOs by now.

I hope more CoXers take a look and share their thoughts with the Silverhelm team to ensure VO is a true successor.  The crew over there is blazing ahead and I'd hate to see them miss the mark because too many folks were nervous or suspicious.

Ohioknight

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #24 on: July 09, 2013, 05:45:10 AM »
Cap, thank you for taking the time to collect and post this. I was  generally aware of the info, but it's nice to have it all in one spot, with cliff's notes on what each is. I was never particularly clear on what the difference between Phoenix and H&V was, merely that they were born of a schism in the project; so now I know that one is more closely an homage while the other is more tonally different but related.

I gather there's one other major difference... H&V is tied to the "Hero Engine" which is a generic RPG game generator package -- the team is customizing it to become a COH play-alike, but technically it will be limited to the Hero Engine package's capabilities.

TPP is being more ambitious technically and attempting to use newer-generation tools and systems to develop a more advanced looking and playing system than good old COX. 

TPP has (I gather) a larger developer community working on this, but when developing new tech there's always a risk.  H&V might find their underlying system can't handle what they want it to do at some point, but if it does then THEORETICALLY they are lowering the development risk by using an "off the shelf" game engine.
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Captain Electric

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #25 on: July 09, 2013, 06:12:21 AM »
I don't know if this helps or hinders your point, but the Hero Engine is the engine used by SWTOR as well as an in-development MMO I've been keeping up with, The Repopulation.

TPP is using the Unreal Engine. Neither project is "developing new tech."

(Conversely, City of Heroes developed its own engine.)

The Fifth Horseman

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #26 on: July 09, 2013, 09:33:33 AM »
may I ask which of the nc games closed last before city of. I ask because I found real emus 's for exxteal, auto assault, and tabula rasa. If I had this info I could calculate how much time it would take for city of to be able to get a emu.
Exteel in September 2010. Tabula Rasa in February 2009. Auto Assault in August 2007.

Also, not a valid basis for calculation. Private servers were most likely already in the works before the shutdown (as were some for CoH)
« Last Edit: July 09, 2013, 09:44:27 AM by The Fifth Horseman »
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General Idiot

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #27 on: July 09, 2013, 04:49:53 PM »
Exteel in September 2010. Tabula Rasa in February 2009. Auto Assault in August 2007.

Also, not a valid basis for calculation. Private servers were most likely already in the works before the shutdown (as were some for CoH)

Additionally, none of those three games were eight years old at the time of closing. Thus, none of them had anywhere near as much accumulated crud as CoH did. Rumor has it the CoH servers were more complex than most MMOs even at the start, and that was before they added things like bases, AE, power customisation, a million new powersets, not one but two alternate factions and one with two sub-factions... the list goes on. Each new thing is that much more for the server to keep track of, and thus that much more work for anyone building an emulator.

That's not to say it won't happen, just that it might take a while.

Angel Phoenix77

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #28 on: July 09, 2013, 09:29:09 PM »
Exteel in September 2010. Tabula Rasa in February 2009. Auto Assault in August 2007.

Also, not a valid basis for calculation. Private servers were most likely already in the works before the shutdown (as were some for CoH)
very true, but it does give abit of a time line.
exteel was 2010, now some people are working on a emu. 3 years
tabula rasa 2009 the 1st attempt at a emu was closed down to nc soft. the website i viewed yesterday listed 2012 for the emu. 3 years
auto assault the web site i viewed for it was 2011, 3 years.
i know what does this have to do with city of. by my math all we have to do is wait for 3 years for someone to make a emu server. so all we got to do is wait for 3 years for city of to come back to us. if google or disney isnt interested in city of.
to the people who worked on icon, i would like to say thank you for working on it. 
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Golden Girl

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #29 on: July 09, 2013, 09:51:36 PM »
I gather there's one other major difference... H&V is tied to the "Hero Engine" which is a generic RPG game generator package -- the team is customizing it to become a COH play-alike, but technically it will be limited to the Hero Engine package's capabilities.

TPP is being more ambitious technically and attempting to use newer-generation tools and systems to develop a more advanced looking and playing system than good old COX. 

TPP has (I gather) a larger developer community working on this, but when developing new tech there's always a risk.  H&V might find their underlying system can't handle what they want it to do at some point, but if it does then THEORETICALLY they are lowering the development risk by using an "off the shelf" game engine.

All 3 projects are using off the shelf engine packages:

HaV - HeroEngine

Phoenix - Unreal

Valiance - Unity

While there are some strange people attached to some of the projects, as far as I know there's no one on any of them that's insane enough to suggest that a volunteer/amateur project should try building it's own MMO engine from scratch :P
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dwturducken

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #30 on: July 09, 2013, 11:24:13 PM »
It's worth noting that VO availed themselves of the further "shortcut" of purchasing a fairly decent building model package. While I'm not endorsing it, since it was a pretty expensive package, conceivably that route could either drastically shorten the development time or make this kind of project feasible for an individual or small team. It could, however, cost thousands of dollars.
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Zombie Man

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #31 on: July 10, 2013, 01:32:20 AM »
Also, remember, when evaluating 'how far along' a project is, to include all the essential game elements such as a developed universe lore, a large number of scripted missions, a schema for creating classes (or will it be an open point system... has that even been decided yet), a schema for creating and balancing powers, plans to include other CoH elements such as base building or a player-created mission architect, etc....

And even then, each element has its own nuances, some of which have become very important to the CoH player base, e.g., in the costume creator, how many elements are customizable (e.g., how many accessories can you add to the head or torso?); or, for the powers, will certain types of powers be tied to a class (e.g., only 'tanks' can have stone powers) or will there be complete proliferation?.

There are *a lot* of systems that together make up a working game. And even more that would recreate a CoH-like experience. How far along is each project on each of those working parts?

Ohioknight

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #32 on: July 10, 2013, 02:02:48 AM »
I don't know if this helps or hinders your point, but the Hero Engine is the engine used by SWTOR as well as an in-development MMO I've been keeping up with, The Repopulation.

TPP is using the Unreal Engine. Neither project is "developing new tech."

(Conversely, City of Heroes developed its own engine.)

I'm a bit out of touch with TPP's tech approach -- when I last looked at their development plan in detail, they hadn't switched engines yet --  but I had the impression that the "Unreal Engine" was a much less complete (and therefore less constraining -- more customizable) technology than "Hero Engine" and was newer tech -- and that "Hero Engine" basically gave you a fully implemented game environment which you "tweaked" to support the features and content of your specific project.

If I've got that wrong, please correct me as I've no desire to shoot my mouth off about something I'm misunderstanding.
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Ohioknight

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #33 on: July 10, 2013, 02:11:29 AM »
All 3 projects are using off the shelf engine packages:

HaV - HeroEngine

Phoenix - Unreal

Valiance - Unity

While there are some strange people attached to some of the projects, as far as I know there's no one on any of them that's insane enough to suggest that a volunteer/amateur project should try building it's own MMO engine from scratch :P
 

Thanks, GG.  I'd had the impression that Hero Engine provided a more completely developed environment than the others, but I wouldn't claim to be even literate in this tech.
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Nightwatch

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #34 on: July 10, 2013, 01:46:21 PM »
All 3 projects are using off the shelf engine packages:

HaV - HeroEngine

Phoenix - Unreal

Valiance - Unity

While there are some strange people attached to some of the projects, as far as I know there's no one on any of them that's insane enough to suggest that a volunteer/amateur project should try building it's own MMO engine from scratch :P

Can I just say - thank to all the three groups developing these!  I've been following HaV and Phoenix and will now have a look at Valliance (I had the same scepticism others have expressed when I first heard of Valliance).  I want all three to succeed and would happily pay to play all three if they are close enough to the original CoX.  All of us non-techies owe you our souls if you can return even a percentage of the joy we felt in playing CoX.


DeathSentry

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #36 on: January 21, 2014, 02:34:16 AM »
I played on the VO alpha and they are quite far along... I am pretty confident that they will be the first out the gate... I am hoping that the others will actually happen though am doubtful about H&V

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_engine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HeroEngine

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unreal_Engine

JaguarX

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #37 on: January 21, 2014, 06:21:47 AM »
I played on the VO alpha and they are quite far along... I am pretty confident that they will be the first out the gate... I am hoping that the others will actually happen though am doubtful about H&V
indeed.

But I think H&V will pull through also. Outside of kickstarter, the amount of stuff and progress they have shown thus far is about the same if not actually more than MWM have at this point.

MWRuger

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #38 on: January 22, 2014, 12:04:52 AM »
Design by committee always takes long than fulfilling one vision.
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JaguarX

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Re: help! someone give me updates on COH emulator, server, something!
« Reply #39 on: January 22, 2014, 12:20:13 AM »
Design by committee always takes long than fulfilling one vision.
indeed.

Well depends on the committee. If they all like the same things and simply going through the motions to make it look like others have a voice but in reality already have their mind made up, then it could be about as swift as simply having one vision if the fluff is dropped. :p