New efforts!

[Arcana]

Pretty sure Tyger42 meant solo as opposed to on a team, not solo as in on client-side computer.

I think what Codewalker was trying to explain was that City of Heroes was implemented with an architecture that is significantly more complex than the typical single player game, and there's no way to trivially reverse engineer that architecture even when in possession of the game client.  A lot of people think turning the game client into a single player game would be easier than starting from scratch, because you have the game client.  But I believe, and I think Codewalker would agree, that trying to build an engine the game client would understand sufficiently well to enable all elements of the game *except* for multiplayer access could be technically more challenging than actually writing an MMO from scratch with all of the multiplayer bits functioning.  The fact that players can play the game solo doesn't mean there exists an important subset of the game that can satisfy that particular goal only. 

To put it another way, having the game client and trying to rebuild the rest of the game in a way that the client works properly is like owning a dashboard and being asked to build a car around it.  You aren't saving as much time as you might think, and adding the requirement that the rest of the car physically incorporate it and electronically work with it could actually be more difficult than building an entire car from scratch.


There's an old joke in mathematics (specifically a logical joke) that goes like this: you are in a cabin in the woods and you want to make tea.  You have a pack of matches, a box of teabags, a stack of wood, a functional fireplace, and a teakettle.  Describe how to make tea.  Answer: fill teakettle with water, stack wood in fireplace, strike match, alight wood stack, hang teakettle over fire, wait for water to boil, add teabag, pour tea.  So now suppose you have a the same situation but you have a teakettle full of water and a fire burning in the fireplace.  Now how do you make tea?  Answer: empty the teakettle, put out the fire, and you've reduced the problem to a previously solved one.  QED.

[Manga]

A good way to understand how MMO game clients work is it's like a really nice Lego set locked in a glass case.  The server tells the Lego pieces how to assemble so you play the game - without it, you just have a pile of Lego bricks that you can't touch.

Paragon Chat tells tricks that pile of Lego bricks into assembling something that resembles CoH, but it's not quite what an actual server would do.

[switch]

On one hand, it is really insulting and I don't want to ever give NCsoft money ever again.

However on the other hand..imagine the board meeting if in the first day States is released..everyone who wants COH to return buys States, his skins and all that..then uninstalls the game and never touches it.

so wait   not only did they slap us in the face  with statesman he's gonnna be a character u have to purchase ?        if thats the case  im pissed and insulted even more then i was

[Taceus Jiwede]

I don't actually know if this is him, but:

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/121710536/a-new-mathematical-system/description

Awww:( Even if it is a stupid idea it breaks my heart to see that because you know that person was really hoping for a big break. 

Pretty sure Tyger42 meant solo as opposed to on a team, not solo as in on client-side computer.

I am with Vee that it seemed to me that Tyger42 was commenting on the content of CoH as opposed to the technical side of it.  While the amount of solo content in CoH is completely irrelevant to the technical side it just seems to me Tyger42 and Codewalker were discussing different things - even if the content is only possible with the server side stuff.  I do think VV's "You don't know s**t" post was unnecessary of a response to the statement, even if all the solo content in the world doesn't mean a thing without the server side data.  Regardless of how much or little Tyger42 may or may not know about server side stuff or MMO's or whether or not they misunderstood the topic and just commented on the content and not what goes into it, there is no reason to be like "Wow you clearly don't know anything" when you could just simply say "There is a lot of solo content but accessing on a solo server would be very difficult"

[Sinistar]

Awww:( Even if it is a stupid idea it breaks my heart to see that because you know that person was really hoping for a big break. 



I am with Vee that it seemed to me that Tyger42 was commenting on the content of CoH as opposed to the technical side of it.  While the amount of solo content in CoH is completely irrelevant to the technical side it just seems to me Tyger42 and Codewalker were discussing different things - even if the content is only possible with the server side stuff.  I do think VV's "You don't know s**t" post was unnecessary of a response to the statement, even if all the solo content in the world doesn't mean a thing without the server side data.  Regardless of how much or little Tyger42 may or may not know about server side stuff or MMO's or whether or not they misunderstood the topic and just commented on the content and not what goes into it, there is no reason to be like "Wow you clearly don't know anything" when you could just simply say "There is a lot of solo content but accessing on a solo server would be very difficult"

If a solo CoH emulator came out,  here is what I'd like to see:

1. all missions
2. all task/strike forces/ incarnate trials with an option to SOLO them

An admin menu that among other things lets you spawn AI Bots of different character types and power sets thus being able to form a team that you could control like master mind pets and thus be able to run the task/strike forces and incarnate trials with a team.

Yes I know, difficult if not impossible to implement but a CoH fan can hope, can they not?

[Arcana]

A good way to understand how MMO game clients work is it's like a really nice Lego set locked in a glass case.  The server tells the Lego pieces how to assemble so you play the game - without it, you just have a pile of Lego bricks that you can't touch.

Paragon Chat tells tricks that pile of Lego bricks into assembling something that resembles CoH, but it's not quite what an actual server would do.

I'm not sure that analogy is illustrative.  A better analogy would be to say that the game client is a giant set of Lego, as the actual City of Heroes game is to The Lego Movie.  In one sense having a giant set of Lego makes it easier to make The Lego Movie.  But in another more important sense, not really.

[Taceus Jiwede]

If a solo CoH emulator came out,  here is what I'd like to see:

1. all missions
2. all task/strike forces/ incarnate trials with an option to SOLO them

An admin menu that among other things lets you spawn AI Bots of different character types and power sets thus being able to form a team that you could control like master mind pets and thus be able to run the task/strike forces and incarnate trials with a team.

Yes I know, difficult if not impossible to implement but a CoH fan can hope, can they not?

If difficult were impossible the world would be a much less advanced place:)  I have faith in Codewalker and others, I also trust them when they say its super hard to do lol. But I am with you that as long as I can hope its all good:) I actually never thought about the need to be able to do TF's solo,its been so long I forgot that if you wanted to Solo a TF you had to get the team then disband it.

[Sinistar]

If difficult were impossible the world would be a much less advanced place:)  I have faith in Codewalker and others, I also trust them when they say its super hard to do lol. But I am with you that as long as I can hope its all good:) I actually never thought about the need to be able to do TF's solo,its been so long I forgot that if you wanted to Solo a TF you had to get the team then disband it.

Yeah I really hated having to wait around for people to take a few minutes to act as a filler so that I could launch a solo ITF, or a solo LGTF (mission 4 with the Hami was a little tricky when solo).

[Vee]

Yeah I really hated having to wait around for people to take a few minutes to act as a filler so that I could launch a solo ITF, or a solo LGTF (mission 4 with the Hami was a little tricky when solo).

Did you solo LGTF after Castle buffed the hami fight? Cause that's pretty darned impressive if so. Highly doubt i could have soloed it before that but I'm positive i couldn't after.

[Mistress Urd]

I hope to see all of you fellow CoHers in the next game if I haven't already. 

Good Luck and best wishes

[Arcana]

If difficult were impossible the world would be a much less advanced place:)  I have faith in Codewalker and others, I also trust them when they say its super hard to do lol. But I am with you that as long as I can hope its all good:) I actually never thought about the need to be able to do TF's solo,its been so long I forgot that if you wanted to Solo a TF you had to get the team then disband it.

After Freedom came out, I created about nine freemium accounts and PLed stuff in them specifically so I could launch solo anything - short of an incarnate trial anyway.  I got Master of ITF specifically this way.

Heck, if the game lasted long enough, I probably would have tried to get Master of Underground this way eventually. 

[LateNights]

Surely if Codewalker gets us to that promised land it would be far easier to just lift the restrictions on tf's & whatnot than it would be to add completely new systems??

Although, I also wondered if incarnate pets could serve the purpose - again I have the feeling lifting the restrictions would still be a more simple solution...

Still, I hate dropping this in Codewalkers lap considering the legal implications - no matter how much I'd love for it to happen.

[Sinistar]

Surely if Codewalker gets us to that promised land it would be far easier to just lift the restrictions on tf's & whatnot than it would be to add completely new systems??

Although, I also wondered if incarnate pets could serve the purpose - again I have the feeling lifting the restrictions would still be a more simple solution...

Still, I hate dropping this in Codewalkers lap considering the legal implications - no matter how much I'd love for it to happen.

Oh i agree with you about the legal implications, but then again since NCSoft wants to stick it to us, I have no problems seeing them get shafted somehow in return.  Frankly I hope NCSoft goes out of business and has to sell off their properties including CoH.

[Sinistar]

I hope to see all of you fellow CoHers in the next game if I haven't already. 

Good Luck and best wishes

You're not leaving here are you? Please stay.

[Sinistar]

Did you solo LGTF after Castle buffed the hami fight? Cause that's pretty darned impressive if so. Highly doubt i could have soloed it before that but I'm positive i couldn't after.

Soloing the LGTF depended greatly on one's archetype and powersets and also if they had any powers to help debuff the green mitos and take them down as they were the problem of soloing mission 4.

Missions 1 and 3 I'd finish by letting the enemy take down the hostages that we had to rescue, misson 2 was fairly easy to solo and so was mission 5.   It was Mission 4 that was the sticking point.

[Vee]

Yeah I'm drawing a blank on what would have enough holds for the post-buff mitos, ranged and melee dps, enough debuffs for the AVs plus be able to shrug off the endurance drains.

[LateNights]

Frankly I hope NCSoft goes out of business and has to sell off their properties including CoH.

I had hoped they may at least have given up on the western market and in doing so decided to take up the offer of passing on the I.P to those that cared for it a little more than perhaps they themselves seem to...

The worst thing is they can't be totally unaware of the attachment many MMO players hold for games they devote a significant part of their existence to!!

P.s I wasn't attacking you nor anyone else btw, I'd love to see the game again as much as anyone - hell I myself hope Codewalker can do it - just wary that we might be asking a lot of one person to make it happen.

[Angel Phoenix77]

You know for soloing what they could do is what star wars tor does, and gives you a temp companion. But that would need to fill the minimum requirements though.

[Nyx Nought Nothing]

After Freedom came out, I created about nine freemium accounts and PLed stuff in them specifically so I could launch solo anything - short of an incarnate trial anyway.  I got Master of ITF specifically this way.

Heck, if the game lasted long enough, I probably would have tried to get Master of Underground this way eventually.

With an Energy/Energy Blaster? Personally i never really attempted to solo any "Master of" TFs or SFs, or most of the standard TF/SF/Trial runs. While i made characters and builds that i found entertaining i was never very optimal in builds or gameplay. Still, i'll bet that D3 who soloed Romulus in a minute could do it too. (As a further aside i can't recall if that was the same person who complained on the official forums that Darkest Night was a bad power because all it did was generate aggro.)

[Arcana]

With an Energy/Energy Blaster?

Without maximal incarnate pets, that would have been very difficult to solo with an energy/energy blaster.  However, the granite tank in account #3 and the mind dom in account #4 made it a tad easier.

I said I was solo.  I didn't say my main was solo.  :p