New efforts!

[Captain Electric]

I said my piece long ago, hundreds of pages back. I'm happy there's a team working on this deal; and Ironwolf is a real hero--but not a very modest one, and potentially a reckless one. Any publicity began with Ironwolf. If there are repercussions owing to publicity, they won't have stemmed from Duane, or any member of the gaming press, these forums, or Facebook. Some people here really need a dose of reality, especially now that the gaming press is being demonized by some here for reporting on newsworthy events made public--something we can't get enough of when it's convenient for us.

Ironwolf, if publicity could be harmful to something good, then PLEASE don't make something public. But that is what you've done, and have been doing for several months, on the game's largest surviving fan site. Once you've let something like this out of the bag, you can no longer control the public's reaction to it--or the press. The only way to preserve secrecy when it's needed is--guess what--keep your trap shut. When outbursts of publicity occur regarding the negotiations, when you see people shifting the blame away from you and onto others in this forum community and on Facebook, you should be correcting them every time. You made this public. Not them.

I sincerely salute you for your efforts, and in the event that you haven't sabotaged them, I'll be very grateful; but I doubt that I would ever trust you with an important secret. You're very lucky that it took this long for a popular gaming site to pick up this story. You'll be very, very lucky if that's the end of it.

[Dev7on]

Ironwolf, if publicity could be harmful to something good, then PLEASE don't make something public. But that is what you've done, and have been doing for several months, on the game's largest surviving fan site. Once you've let something like this out of the bag, you can no longer control the public's reaction to it--or the press. The only way to preserve secrecy when it's needed is--guess what--keep your trap shut. When outbursts of publicity occur regarding the negotiations, when you see people shifting the blame away from you and onto others in this forum community and on Facebook, you should be correcting them every time. You made this public. Not them.

I sincerely salute you for your efforts, and in the event that you haven't sabotaged them, I'll be very grateful; but I doubt that I would ever trust you with an important secret. You're very lucky that it took this long for a popular gaming site to pick up this story. You'll be very, very lucky if that's the end of it.

I don't understand why are people blaming on Ironwolf. He didn't even do anything!!! Like he said before he was giving out updates the community from the bottom of his heart. He wanted to give out updates because he had the privilege to do so from the mysterious studio. He didn't even know this was going to get crazy. So now people are going to turn around backstab and criticize   Ironwolf? You guys need to THINK BEFORE YOU SAY ANYTHING!!!............I'm sorry that I'm posting this.......I'm just upset and confused right now.

[Solitaire]

I think we need to stop pointing fingers and blaming one person or another, lets just focus on getting the game back for the time being.

 As I believe this is what we all want to happen.

[Tenthyr]

Dev7on, No one is flinging insultsa and blaming. But Captain electric is also perfectly correct. If the information was sensitive, then it shouldn't have been on a public forum. And if that was the case, than that was Ironwolf's mistake. No one is angry, it was nice to know that something was happening. But that doesn't change the facts. This doesn't matter though, lets just wait and see what happens.

[kiario]

I said my piece long ago, hundreds of pages back. I'm happy there's a team working on this deal; and Ironwolf is a real hero--but not a very modest one, and potentially a reckless one. Any publicity began with Ironwolf. If there are repercussions owing to publicity, they won't have stemmed from Duane, or any member of the gaming press, these forums, or Facebook. Some people here really need a dose of reality, especially now that the gaming press is being demonized by some here for reporting on newsworthy events made public--something we can't get enough of when it's convenient for us.

Ironwolf, if publicity could be harmful to something good, then PLEASE don't make something public. But that is what you've done, and have been doing for several months, on the game's largest surviving fan site. Once you've let something like this out of the bag, you can no longer control the public's reaction to it--or the press. The only way to preserve secrecy when it's needed is--guess what--keep your trap shut. When outbursts of publicity occur regarding the negotiations, when you see people shifting the blame away from you and onto others in this forum community and on Facebook, you should be correcting them every time. You made this public. Not them.

I sincerely salute you for your efforts, and in the event that you haven't sabotaged them, I'll be very grateful; but I doubt that I would ever trust you with an important secret. You're very lucky that it took this long for a popular gaming site to pick up this story. You'll be very, very lucky if that's the end of it.

As I understand Ironwolf has only reported what he has been allowed to by the secret team. And I thank him for that. And I don't think for a second that it has been harmfull. Instead beneficial.

[TonyV]

[Tenthyr]

I vote we talk about puppies. Or kittens. Puppy-kitten hybrids? CAN WE GET THOSE? I WANT.

[Captain Electric]

Correct, Tenthyr. Also, Dev7on, I understand that you're upset and confused; but I assure you, I'm not "turning around and backstabbing" anyone. It has always been my position that sensitive, need-to-know information should not be handed casually to thousands of fans, whether or not it is from the bottom of someone's heart or some other bodily organ. I didn't have a problem with Ironwolf's updates on the "secretive" negotiations until the point where he started cautioning everyone to quieten down about everything. And then the suggestion began floating around that "we" might harm the negotiations if we didn't. That was my first clue that Ironwolf had overshared and possibly brought harm to his own cause.

You can admonish me for playing the blame game, but you'd be missing the point. I think it's very clear that my reason for posting is to caution this community against doing exactly that among each other. When outbursts of publicity arose on Facebook, people commonly warned each other, saying that it would be all their fault if they couldn't keep quiet. That's playing the blame game. When stories like this break (as they're almost sure to continue to do now), tipsters or journalists will get blamed. That's playing the blame game. The original tipster is Ironwolf. He did not need to bring thousands of fans into the loop in order to help facilitate the negotiations between those involved. If you believe that it's okay for him to post updates on the game's most read fan forum, but it's not okay for people to actually spread the news, then I have a bridge that I'd like to sell you--because that's exactly what fans are going to do: spread the news. And no one should blame them for it.

The game reached cult status during life and has maintained it after death. The only way to keep fans mum is not to tell them anything.

[Triplash]

Looking forward to the smorglebossum with each passing day!

*looks at Cap's signature*

*blinks*

What the heck is a snorkleblossom?

[Captain Electric]

One thing I keep forgetting to mention: next time y'all are checking this thread, scroll down to the bottom of the forum homepage and click on the Users Online link. Take a look at how many people with the user ID of Guest are also checking on this thread. This is by no means a small, private conversation we're all having.

Yes, Tenthyr, we can now talk about puppy-kitten hybrids if you like.

*looks at Cap's signature*

*blinks*

What the heck is a snorkleblossom?

http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,9983.msg144550.html#msg144550 

[Eskreema]

Pancackes and gravy.  French fries and gravy.  Gravy and gravy.  That is all.

[Triplash]

http://www.cohtitan.com/forum/index.php/topic,9983.msg144550.html#msg144550 

Ohhhhhh. Then I'm looking forward to the snorkleblossom too!

Yaaay snorkleblossoms!

[Ironwolf]

Ah, but you see when this thread started - there was no team to recover the game - it was me.

Then things changed and started to roll and we didn't know at the onset that NCSoft would not want publicity. I was covering for the team not NCSoft. During the talks the team found NCSoft was unhappy with how the first effort was publicized and so everything changed.

This was not the same effort from start to finish. Perspective is your friend. The effort changed for trying to find a way to recover the game to finding out that holy crap NCSoft will sell if approached correctly. Then from they will sell to they would like to do this quietly as possible. Without masks, capes and other fan backlash.

This was not known until far into the effort. Without my making things public in the first place there would be no effort now, Perspective. If you thinks that makes me not modest somehow - ok your opinion. I have stated from day one - if we get the game from NCSoft - the team has it's own people and you will see me disappear.

[HEATSTROKE]

 My issue is that the article was poorly written and erroneous. It didnt interview anyone. It didnt follow any leads.. It didnt even accurately follow the timeline that was written in the very first post... It was a POOR article..

[Cailyn Alaynn]

My issue with the article wasn't that it was made... I don't think it's so much the publicity NC didn't like previously, but more the...Oh...How to put it nicely... the WAY people were talking, not THAT they were talking.

Which is kind of my issue with the article. "Knock offs"? That's just rude.

[Styrj]

Poorly written indeed!  The author was lazy by not doing any leg work to get the facts and the writing style told me that he had a predetermined negative outlook towards CoHV.

I for one was and will continue to back Ironwolf and the team for their efforts to get our City back.

[SemanticAntics]

Unless you actually know the people at NCsoft involved well enough to understand their personalities and motivations, either thought is just as valid as the other.  And even if you did, it is still a bit insulting to insinuate that their motives are so transparent and predictable.

I rather think the point of saying there's a cultural difference is much the opposite of saying their motives are transparent and predictable. As I see it, at least, pointing out the divide is meant to say that these things are often inscrutable and unpredictable. The most obvious example is the collapse of the last attempt to buy the IP. Even though something as simple as publicity may be inconsequential (or even beneficial) to our way of thinking, it can be (and indeed, was) a decidedly negative thing to at least a handful of people at NCSoft. Whether that represents NCSoft culture, Korean culture, Asian culture, or just simply the mindset of a single individual in a key position, it is a critical distinction from our own way of thinking that we need to keep in mind.

I don't personally think the Massively article will be a problem. I don't even think a handful of loose cannons will be a significant problem. So long as we, as a community, are not trying to organize against NCSoft to "force their hand," if you will, I am optimistic that the folks who are in the position to sell us what we want will continue to be open to selling it.

At any rate, all that is before us is to go from here. If there needs to be fewer updates (or none at all) until this thing is done, then so be it. If we can continue this in a more private location, that might be better.

[Shifter]

My issue is that the article was poorly written and erroneous. It didnt interview anyone. It didnt follow any leads.. It didnt even accurately follow the timeline that was written in the very first post... It was a POOR article..

And in other news, someone on the internet said...
Yeh, any respectable news service would be laughed at I must say.

[MWRuger]

It was going to happen eventually.

I was a little surprised it took this long for someone to report it. Heck, I thought they were all holding back in hopes that it helped the effort!

It's august 19th.  5 months since we started talking about it. If this kills the deal, then I think it will just be an excuse that is being used to kill it. This far along in the deal both parties have spent time and money and have incentive to complete the deal. This should not scuttle it.

[r00tb0ySlim]

This far along in the deal both parties have spent time and money and have incentive to complete the deal. This should not scuttle it.

Agreed.  Time is money and there should be a vested interest here.