Author Topic: Avengers: Endgame  (Read 3070 times)

ryuplaneswalker

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2019, 06:29:14 AM »
Comic book logic of course, but to be fair:

Spoiler for Hidden:
The problem wasn't flying through the ground troops, it was delivering the Stark Infinity Gauntlet intact.  Think of a football linebacker trying to force his way through a crowd while cradling an egg.  We see the infinity stones aren't impossible to remove - Thanos uses the space stone against Danvers - so having help clearing a path through the crowd wasn't completely without purpose.  Those troops might not have been able to stop her, but they could have jarred the gauntlet out of her hands or even just knocked a single stone off of it.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Them splitting the stones and trying to get each one to the van individually would have made for a far better sequence. The only bad part of the movie was how everyone not Captain Marvel, Tony Stark or Captain America was completely wasted.

Dev7on

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2019, 04:24:12 PM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
How do you put the Soul Stone back to Vormire in 2014 when Bruce just said they can't reverse Black Widow's death? So that means Black Widow and Gamora are trapped in the Soul Stone?

Arcana

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2019, 10:12:50 PM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
Them splitting the stones and trying to get each one to the van individually would have made for a far better sequence. The only bad part of the movie was how everyone not Captain Marvel, Tony Stark or Captain America was completely wasted.

Spoiler for Hidden:
That would be problematic due to the fact that it has been pre-established that attempting to wield or even hold a single bare infinity stone can kill most beings not strong enough to contain the power.  There was no immediately obvious way to take the bare stones off the gauntlet without potentially killing most of those characters.  And there's an additional tactical problem that if you split up the stones you have to defend all of them: if Thanos gets even one of them he probably becomes too powerful to stop very quickly.  Splitting them up makes sense if Thanos must get them all.  But in this situation, he really only needs to get one to make life really difficult for the Avengers.

Zombie Man

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #23 on: May 11, 2019, 06:08:03 AM »
I suspect they will go in directions most people aren't really expecting, and I believe Feige has demonstrated he has the patience to set up the long game over a very long period of time.  We've been calling these movies "phase one" and "phase two" but really they are all one big ten year story: the Infinity Saga.  I expect to see less "phase four, phase five" distinctions (even if they call them that) and instead I think they will be constructing another ten year long mega story that we aren't even going to see the full extent of in phase four.

Here's an idea.  I'm not saying this will happen, but it could happen, and it is mostly to suggest just how much room Marvel has to go in any direction they want.  Endgame sets up the Marvel multiverse.  We know there are alternate realities and alternate timelines, and we have hints that some of those are or become different universes, and some diverge and then collapse back.  Some are created and then destroyed.  Suppose there's a scientist in an alternate reality, and he discovers his reality is actually just a splinter universe from the MCU, and it will collapse and disintegrate.  So he decides he's going to try to escape that universe and enter the main one.  But when his ship escapes the end of his universe and he makes it into the MCU cosmology, he's altered by the process and becomes an MCU celestial being, like Ego.  Except this celestial being has a cosmic hunger, and a need to feed on the cosmic energy of the universe. 

Fortunately, the MCU is filled with the energy released from the Infinity Stones, and he can consume that energy on every world where it has collected.  Thus he becomes a world-destroying threat that attracts the attention of Captain Marvel, the Guardians of the Galaxy, and Thor: the space faring Avengers.  But eventually, he seeks the source of that energy and creates a herald who can search the cosmos for the strongest source of that energy, which happens to be the last world where the Infinity Stones were used.

There's easily ten years of material in there, and the new threat wouldn't just appear, it would be referenced and hinted at, then start affecting the MCU, then finally become an existential threat.

You're as prescient as ever...

In Endgame, the Sorcerer Supreme says the stones are needed to keep time coherently moving forward. But they're gone, so... oopsie.

Far From Home spoiler

Spoiler for Hidden:
Fury tells Peter there's a multiverse


Agents of SHIELD spoiler

Spoiler for Hidden:
A doppelganger from what appears to be an alternate universe breaks into SHIELD's universe.

The multiverse is happening.

ryuplaneswalker

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #24 on: May 11, 2019, 08:51:28 AM »
I feel we need to take that Far From Home example with a very large grain of salt.

Erhem I want to rant about this.

Spoiler for Hidden:
WHY ARE YOU TAKING ANYTHING MYSTERIO SAYS AT FACE VALUE, HE IS MYSTERIO. His entire shtick is being full of crap! He is lying to make himself look good!
« Last Edit: May 11, 2019, 09:00:26 AM by ryuplaneswalker »

wufenstein

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #25 on: May 11, 2019, 06:23:18 PM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
That would be problematic due to the fact that it has been pre-established that attempting to wield or even hold a single bare infinity stone can kill most beings not strong enough to contain the power.  There was no immediately obvious way to take the bare stones off the gauntlet without potentially killing most of those characters.  And there's an additional tactical problem that if you split up the stones you have to defend all of them: if Thanos gets even one of them he probably becomes too powerful to stop very quickly.  Splitting them up makes sense if Thanos must get them all.  But in this situation, he really only needs to get one to make life really difficult for the Avengers.

Spoiler for Hidden:
Only the Power Stone is dangerous to the wielder on its own. Banner held the Time Stone and Hawkeye the Soul Stone with no ill effects, but even Thanos seemed to be in pain when he had to take the Power Stone out of the gauntlet to use it against Captain Marvel.

Blondeshell

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #26 on: May 11, 2019, 09:13:36 PM »
Agents of SHIELD spoiler

Spoiler for Hidden:
A doppelganger from what appears to be an alternate universe breaks into SHIELD's universe.

The multiverse is happening.

Yeah, looking forward to how this season plays out.

Mandu

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #27 on: May 12, 2019, 05:18:10 AM »
I feel we need to take that Far From Home example with a very large grain of salt.

Erhem I want to rant about this.

Spoiler for Hidden:
WHY ARE YOU TAKING ANYTHING MYSTERIO SAYS AT FACE VALUE, HE IS MYSTERIO. His entire shtick is being full of crap! He is lying to make himself look good!

Spoiler for Hidden:
Well yeah Mysterio lies but I don't think Fury would just accept he was from another dimension unless there were breakthroughs happening in other locations.  It is however entirely possible that Mysterio knows about breakthroughs and took advantage of that to come up with his story.  I actually got excited at the SHIELD scenes because it showed that they were at least trying to still tie together the TV and movie universes.

doc7924

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #28 on: May 12, 2019, 11:40:42 AM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
Well yeah Mysterio lies but I don't think Fury would just accept he was from another dimension unless there were breakthroughs happening in other locations.  It is however entirely possible that Mysterio knows about breakthroughs and took advantage of that to come up with his story.  I actually got excited at the SHIELD scenes because it showed that they were at least trying to still tie together the TV and movie universes.

Though one of the actors said in an interview SHIELD is now basically removed from the MCU.

But now we could have an explanation because of all this.

And I agree about Fury - he's not that gullible. 

ryuplaneswalker

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #29 on: May 12, 2019, 11:54:19 AM »
Quote
Though one of the actors said in an interview SHIELD is now basically removed from the MCU.

The Writers didn't get that note, because the Finale of the Last Season of SHIELD occurred just as Infinity War was starting.

doc7924

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #30 on: May 12, 2019, 03:53:53 PM »
The Writers didn't get that note, because the Finale of the Last Season of SHIELD occurred just as Infinity War was starting.

She meant starting this season - which is odd considering the multiverse was mentioned in the Spidey trailer and this season has people from an other reality invading.

MyriVerse

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #31 on: May 12, 2019, 04:25:10 PM »
At this point, SHIELD has done more monkeying with time than Endgame did. And they didn't even need any stones.
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Blondeshell

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #32 on: May 12, 2019, 05:54:33 PM »
I just keep looking forward to any explicit reference SHIELD might make to being post-snap.

doc7924

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #33 on: May 12, 2019, 08:46:59 PM »
At this point, SHIELD has done more monkeying with time than Endgame did. And they didn't even need any stones.

I am still trying to figure out the timeloop - they were able to change the future and get back to 2018 because frozen Fitz helps them in that future to get back.

Now if they go and find him and he never gets to the point 75 years later to do what he did, then would they be able to change that future?

I guess its the same logic in EndGame - and probably wont even be addressed - much like the Flash TV series doesn't even bother explaining.

Vee

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #34 on: May 12, 2019, 09:46:09 PM »
I guess its the same logic in EndGame - and probably wont even be addressed - much like the Flash TV series doesn't even bother explaining.

It's more like in both of those that they make a point to explain then do something else anyway :D

ryuplaneswalker

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #35 on: May 12, 2019, 10:10:06 PM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
Now if they go and find him and he never gets to the point 75 years later to do what he did, then would they be able to change that future?

They already did change the future by Earth not blowin up

doc7924

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #36 on: May 13, 2019, 12:03:57 AM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
Now if they go and find him and he never gets to the point 75 years later to do what he did, then would they be able to change that future?

They already did change the future by Earth not blowin up

Right - but they were only able to do that because of frozen Fitz helping them 75 years in the future to get back to their present to stop it.

If he isn't there in the future to help them..........

Zombie Man

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #37 on: May 13, 2019, 06:06:01 AM »
Spoiler for Hidden:
Shield (Fitz and Simmons) has made the point many times that the past and future can't be changed. However, they didn't account for the Inhuman power of the girl who can see past and future who set in motion a time loop. Once inside the time loop, information was shared from future to past on how to break the loop (let Coulson die). Coulson broke the loop by giving away his cure to Quake who then used it to defeat Graviton who then was unable to break the Earth.

To tie it into Endgame, there's now two timelines: one with Earth destroyed and one not. The one not destroyed saved itself with information from the other timeline. Is that timeline now gone? Who knows. In the timeline where Earth wasn't destroyed, Fitz was put into cyro-sleep now for no good reason, so, they're trying to get him back.

ryuplaneswalker

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #38 on: May 13, 2019, 11:29:31 AM »
Right - but they were only able to do that because of frozen Fitz helping them 75 years in the future to get back to their present to stop it.

If he isn't there in the future to help them..........

But they won't need help to get to the past to help them after the Kree take over because the Planet is already not blow'd up because the blow'ding up of the planet would have already happened so the kree won't ever take over the planet and the Agents will arrive at a happy shiny un Kree'd un Snappe'd world.

EmeraldReaper411

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Re: Avengers: Endgame
« Reply #39 on: May 13, 2019, 11:44:07 AM »
The huge battle they had near teh end of the movie was like to me HOLY FUDGE ITS THE MOTHER OF ALL MOVIE SUPER BATTLES!!! THIS IS LIKE SOMETHING STRAIGHT FROM THE COMICS!!.  They did a hell of a job and i liked the way they went canon and made falcon into the next cap but will cap get back his youth like he does in marvel comics thatnks to some huge event?  Only time will tell.  And as for the ending yeah I also really liked it